S4E11 - Deborah Heiser, PhD
This week’s guest is Deborah Heiser, Co-Founder and CEO of The Mentor Project. She also holds a PhD in Applied Developmental Psychology and has studied aging. She even did a TedX talk about rethinking aging (link below).
Deborah’s grandparents were very influential on who she has become today. She came to appreciate older people when visiting her grandmother at an assisted living facility and it changed her perspective on people.
She names her grandfather was her first mentor. As a child she would ride around town with him and observe is interactions with people which were unique as he happened to be the NAACP president in Iowa. He taught her that everyone has a story and also that you don’t have to be liked by everyone.
Deborah co-founded The Mentor Project when she realised the value that mentorship had not only on the mentee but also the person doing the mentoring. She found that people had a lot of knowledge to give and wanted to provide them with a way to meet those who could benefit.
Note from Rabiah (Host):
Mentorship has been a very important part of my life. I have benefitted greatly from people who who have taken the time to share their knowledge and experience with me. I don’t think being a mentee is reserved for the young. As we get older our needs for guidance change. And, as we gain experience and knowledge, as Debbie has found, doing so is rewarding. I have been doing this in different ways at my current company as well as with ic stars (see the episode with Sandee Kastrul to learn more about that organization. Maybe you’ll even become a volunteer!) I’d love to hear about your mentor/mentee stories too.
Rabiah and Deborah chat about mentorship and more. It is a passion for them both and Deborah has done some cool things with it!
Transcript
Rabiah (Host): [00:04:13] Welcome to More Than Work, the podcast reminding you that your self worth is defined by more than your job title. I'm Rabiah, an IT Project Manager, comedian, nonprofit volunteer and sometimes activist. Every week, I'll chat with a guest about pursuing passions outside of work or creating meaningful opportunities inside the workplace.
As you listen, I hope you'll be inspired to do the same. Here we go.
Hey everyone. So welcome to more than work this week. It's Thanksgiving week. So first of all, happy Thanksgiving to everyone. And thank you for being a listener. I appreciate it. If it's your first time listening, or if you've been listening to all 50 something episodes either way, I'm really glad to have you here.
I think this episode is really appropriate for [00:05:13] this week because I talked to someone who has focused on bringing mentors together with mentees. And it's really something that she expresses gratitude about in a way in the podcast. You'll hear it. And I'm very grateful for the opportunities I've had to mentor people so far.
I do it very casually most of the time, and I've also had great mentors who I'm, I'm thankful for, who have helped me get where I am including. Now I have a boss. Who's a great mentor. And actually my most recent boss is also a mentors. It's really great. And those are things I'm thankful for this year, especially in changing jobs and especially in going through, like, all of us are really difficult year and a half or two years.
It's been nice to have those people to lean on and talk to. So I'll just keep this short. I think that if you want guidance or if you think you have some to offer, [00:06:13] listen to this podcast, maybe the mentor project, which is the organization that is a focus during this one. Something that's a good fit for you, or maybe you'll find another one.
I volunteer with IC stars, which I really enjoy. And then I volunteered with the Ms. Society, shatterproof, just different organizations. And so I encourage you to think about adding that as part of your life. If, if you don't have hobbies or you don't think you do, there are ways you can get involved in your community.
I think Thanksgiving is a good time to reflect on what you're thankful for. And maybe what you can give, because when you give you get back, that's just, that's just how it works. I, a hundred percent believe that you, you do get what you give. I'll leave it at that again, happy Thanksgiving to everyone in the us and to everyone else.
I hope you're well. And your holiday season is starting off great. Let's get to the show.
Rabiah (Host): Welcome back everyone. This week I am talking to [00:07:13] Deborah Heiser, she's CEO at The Mentor Project, and I'm really excited to have her here. So how are you doing Debbie?
Deborah Heiser: I'm doing great. And it's a privilege to be on your show. Thank you for having me.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, thanks for being here. So where am I talking to you from?
Deborah Heiser: I'm in New York. I'm right outside the City on Long Island.
Rabiah (Host): Oh, nice. Nice. So I lived there for about five years in the City and I love that place
Deborah Heiser: Yeah, it's a little different now after the pandemic, but it's coming back. I'm
excited.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. Have you seen any plays yet or anything?
Deborah Heiser: No, I went to not a play, but I did get a chance to go to the opera
Rabiah (Host): Oh,
Deborah Heiser: I was able to, see Fire Up Inside My Bones. Great. Uh, it's a big recommendation if anybody likes opera.
Rabiah (Host): Cool, cool. Was that at Lincoln center?
Deborah Heiser: Yeah, it
Rabiah (Host): Oh, amazing.
Deborah Heiser: it was really good.
Rabiah (Host): Oh gosh. Oh, that's so cool. Yeah, it's been opening up. I'm in London has been opening up here and, um, I saw a play, but it's really cool to get to go. Well, that's great. So let's talk [00:08:13] about what you do basically. So we'll start with The Mentor Project , I guess.
Deborah Heiser: Sure. So I'm the CEO of the mentor project and I'm one of the co-founders of it , along with the 2020 Inventor of the Year Bob Cousins. He and I started it. The Mentor Project is an organization where we started with people who were really like the non-obvious leaders of the world, you know? People who have done really amazing things who were not able to give back. They didn't know how to get in touch with mentees.
Like they really want it to be able to share their knowledge and expertise and didn't have an opportunity to do that, which, you know, at the time I thought, how can that possibly be? But once you reach a certain level, you're kind of isolated and not around a lot of kids and don't have that same opportunity.
So, at any rate, um, we started it [00:09:13] and just in 2019 we had about 10 people and we're now at more than 80. We're in, I think, five countries and we essentially take top leaders like the father of the firewall, astronauts, astrophysicists, artists, writers, editors, business leaders, entrepreneur experts, across a whole variety of STEM, arts, business, law, and finance.
And we bring those experts to kids for free around the world to mentor them. So we've had already one student who was 15 for his first, I think 15 for his, first patent and 16 for a second. And now he's selling his patent patented idea. Um, we have had some real amazing successes with kids just taking off because as soon as they get near a mentor who can guide them, [00:10:13] they just need a little bit of coaxing and off they go, and they're able to do things that
elude most regular adults, even.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. And so let's talk about there's so much to get into. So I'm just, I'm really excited about this topic because I love mentorship. I love the fact that I've been able to do that in my small way. And so I want to talk about that, but first this invention, because I read a little bit about this young guy who got something patented.
So can you talk a little bit about that?
Deborah Heiser: Sure. So his name is Ethan Gotian and he had this idea during COVID how to open up doors, uh, without using your hands. And it was a real struggle, you know, here he is. He's like spending time down in his basement, you know, cause he's in isolation, can't go out and do anything and doing all kinds of new write-ups and ideas and everything and how this can work.
And finally, she got to the point where he said, I'd love to be able to patent this. But what kid knows how to patent? [00:11:13] It's not like, as we're like his parents, weren't like, oh, well let me walk you through it. And it's incredibly expensive for most people also to hire an attorney to go through it. So we were able to bring, um, Bob Cousins, the 2020 inventor of the year, as well Jura Zibas who's a top iP attorney to mentor him through the process to tell him what forms to fill out and is he doing it right you know when he had questions and how he could go through it and he got it, it didn't take long. And then he went out and started on another one. And that one has to do with security and video cameras.
And he did the same process that he did the first time. And even more quickly was able to secure a patent. He's going to be a name to really look, look for in the future. That's the sort of thing that is easy if you're a, a prolific patenter,
right? [00:12:13] And they have the ability to do it, to get the kids in the next generation come up with cool ideas and make them come to life. So we're now branching out into doing some entrepreneurial, uh, work to get college students really engaged with mentors who can help them with that because now that say Ethan has this patent, what's he going to do with the business?
I mean, this, this one, somebody wants to buy it. So that's, it's done there, but what if he wanted to go ahead and manufacture something or go ahead and take to market. Most patents we know, um, sit on shelves. No one does anything with them. So we're really excited that we can now bring entrepreneur mentors in for kids who have ideas and want to take them to market. But also so that if they go to work for a company that the gap between knowledge that you learned from books and, and what is required in the real world setting [00:13:13] are going to be narrow.
Rabiah (Host): well, yeah, that is a problem. I've read about it at different universities and then just even knowing when I was in school too, like 20 something years ago, that there was this idea that the students that came from my school, UC San Diego, were more trained to think about just theory rather than new practical things.
And so some places didn't want to hire us because they'd rather hire from the other schools just because they weren't as theory based, right? And so, and that's just coming out of universities, but even if you're not going to university, it's just, you don't learn those skills necessarily. You, you learn how to think about, you know, these ideas, but it's like, how do you do make a spreadsheet properly or something or talk?
Deborah Heiser: You know, it's funny because you saying that reminded me of when I was, I, I have a PhD in Applied Developmental Psychology. And so you want to be able to go out [00:14:13] and work with people, not just learn it from books. That would be a pretty scary thing. If you didn't or if you're a physician and you were going to go treat somebody, but people don't think of that with business, they really don't.
They think you're good to go. If you have some, uh, you know, in school, um, It's not necessarily real world application to it. And so we're trying to change that.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, that is true, actually. I didn't think about. Medical providers. And those people do have to have soft skills too. You know what I mean? I mean, I know they do, and I know a lot of them don't learn them just from my experience, but, but, uh, yeah that's, that's true too. Yeah. I just want to go back first of all, and look at, you know, you have your PhD in Applied Developmental Psychology and you were working in that space and specifically in aging,
right.? [00:15:13] And so, first of all, I guess, can you talk about- just because I like to sometimes delve into things like terms so people can, can get like a setting of what definitions are, but applied developmental psychology versus just maybe I just go to my regular, like psychologist or something. What's what's that entail?
Deborah Heiser: So as an Applied Developmental Psychologist...a developmental psychologist looks at the normal, like if you're a clinical psychologist, you're looking for pathology. So somebody's coming to you with a problem and there there's something wrong. I'm looking at what should we expect through our lifespan from birth through death.
So most developmental psychologists just look at, you know, a pocket of time, usually up until adulthood. It's usually kids, but my area of interest is midlife and beyond like, what do we have to look forward to? What's normal? What should we know is our track and where should we be on that track? [00:16:13] Um, and then, you know, if there's a deviation, how do you get back onto that track?
That's all like not, not then pathologizing everything.
Rabiah (Host): Okay. And so when you, you're looking at aging in that process, I mean, so now I'm 42, so I'm definitely in that thing where now I'm starting to say I'm old and things like that, right? Cause that's what we're supposed to do. And then you know that I have a mom who also says she's old. So now we've got all these old people basically.
But how, how did you get into like aging and what do you look at? Like how do you see it probably differently than a lot of us see it because I actually like that I'm my age. I'm happy with it, but I know maybe in 20 years I won't be like that happy about it. What do you like about, I guess, looking at aging and what have you noticed?
Deborah Heiser: So I used to not think of aging as a good thing. Um, I was like pretty much everybody else where I thought, you know, um, there was [00:17:13] nothing to look forward to and when I was in my twenties, I used to go to visit my grandmother in Florida. And I actually thought that place was the coolest place ever. It was an assisted living facility
and I thought that was like party land. Like they were all having a great time and I would go down there. And one day grandma was completely not herself. She was depressed but I didn't know what that was. And, um, so a psychologist said, don't worry, we'll fix grandma. And I was like, really? And they did. She got fixed.
Uh, she was all better. She wasn't depressed anymore. back to hanging out and having a good time. And so I said, I want to do something like that. And I also knew that I liked older adults and wanted to take a look at what was happening with older adults. And so I went into the field. I started out at, um, prior to my PhD going to, uh, [00:18:13] Cornell Weill . There was a psychiatric hospital.
I worked there for several years working in the aging division and research. And, then I said, this is what I want to do. While I was at a conference right after I got my PhD and I was so proud of getting my PhD in studying aging and studying depression and frailty and all of these things, someone said, well, what's there to look forward to? And I didn't have an answer. And I was completely embarrassed and I, I had. Uh, a life crisis at that moment, like, what was I doing? Like I was adding nothing. Just putting band-aids on old people who are sick. That's not good. So, I took a look at like what I was thinking about and, and life and everything that I had studied.
And I realized that I needed to dial it back to what my area really was, which was development. And I looked at the work of Ericsson and spoke with Dan McAdams, who was sort of like [00:19:13] the Demi God of looking at generativity and realized that in fact we have a lot to look forward to with age. So. You know, once you're in your later fifties and sixties and older, you're happier than when you're in your twenties. And I thought, well, how can that possibly be? Um, you know, we all have an expectation and I talk about this in the TEDTalk, you know, how we expect our life to be a trajectory where it goes up physically, and then there's a sudden decline. And I'm in my fifties, I don't care that I can't run as fast as I did when I was younger.
I really don't.
I don't have any care in the world at all about that. I wear reading glasses. Now. I don't care about that. These are things that I would've thought would have been horrible when I was younger, but as we all age, nobody really cares that much about that. Unless you're an elite athlete maybe. But, started to look at why do people give back?
Why do they get pleasure in that? Why would anybody want that? You know, and [00:20:13] fear in your twenties and thirties, who can't even imagine that. And it really turns out that we're built for that. And so the reach research was showing that that we're built to want to give back. So I said, I need to talk to some people because I want to see if this is really true.
So I talked with about 40 people from four-star generals to grandmas to see what the deal was. And they all were saying the same thing and I'm not joking pretty much everyone cried when they would talk about their mentee and making a difference in somebody's life. When I've talked to mentees, they're like, yeah I got some great advice and they did great things for me, but it's so powerful for a mentor or someone who's giving back or volunteering or doing something, that most of them, almost all of them cried.
It didn't matter If they were like a combat veteran. They cried about it. And, um, so I said, there's something here. That's where it all started. And then I found this whole untapped [00:21:13] world of people who are just clamoring to give back and they don't have a way to find people. So that's why we started The Mentor Project so people who want to leave a legacy, leave a better footprint, do something, get that really cool feeling that you get when you give back a place to do it. We don't tell them what to do. They say, here's what I want to do. And then they engage in that way. And then magic happens.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. So are you still doing the psychology work at all? Are you full on?
Deborah Heiser: I do. I see people as a coach because the work that I am really, really well-trained in that they don't, there was a real gap for, this is people who are transitioning. So th it's normal, there's no pathology here. It's that you're going along, riding along, and then you downsize and people freak out.
Like that's a normal thing. I'm [00:22:13] taking, you know, a big house and I'm getting rid of all of those tchotchkes that I thought were fabulous that no one wants in the family now, you know, like that, that can be hard for people. When you retire, you know, we all grew up having an identity card, it's called a business card, but that's everybody's identity.
What do you do when you're not a lawyer anymore? What do you do when you're not, you know, a teacher? What do you do when you don't have that title? That's where I work, come in and work with people.
Rabiah (Host): Well, and I think just you saying that, and I think about my parents and other people I know have retired and for some people it's like great, but for some people it does, it takes away their identity. I mean, that's kind of the point of this podcast is like our identities being so tied to work anyway.
But, um, I even look at my parents and my dad's still. He's 82 and he's still trying to like drive a truck every day and work because he can't just sit, and he can't just relax. And I feel like just thinking about that versus thinking about my life now where there's all these expectations about what you're supposed to be doing.
[00:23:13] And I feel like those don't even stop. You're supposed to retire and you're supposed to be taking it easy and you're supposed to be happy about it. And that might not be the reality for everyone from a financial perspective or just from what they want. And so are you seeing that when you're helping people through that transition?
What are some ways people can look at maybe transitions in general from your perspective?
Deborah Heiser: I try to help people see that life is a series of pivots. We're really always pivoting rather than, um, ending something. It used to be that you were supposed to take a job, whether you liked it or not, you took it for the rest of your life and then you retired and then you've got to enjoy yourself for two years. And then you died. That was kind of how it was set up with social security. And then that slowly changed. So people now have several smaller jobs where you
can do three different things. People will pivot and midlife to do something that they've always wanted [00:24:13] to do. And now they see a sliver of an opening and they like, I'm going to take it.
It's encouraging people to do that, um, in a way that's responsible in a way that is, I'm not saying this is frustrating me now I'm going to leave it and do something else until it frustrates me. There's a difference between those two things and so I really do though see that we're going to, we are going to now not retire.
Think of retirement as, okay this is where I golf all the time or now played pickle ball. This is where I'm going to do something like maybe I'll do that little passion project like I used to. There was a big surge in people volunteering and doing things like Habitat for Humanity or becoming docents in zoos and other parks, things they didn't get to do when they were younger, that they enjoy.
And that's what I think we're going to be seeing more of whether it's for pay or it's doing more volunteer work in things that bring pleasure.[00:25:13]
Rabiah (Host): I like that. I like that idea too, that you're just kind of pivoting versus either quitting or running from something. So. So then getting back to you again and looking at your story. First of all, as far as mentorship, do you recall in your life, any mentors that you had that specifically impacted you and can you talk about any of them or how?
Deborah Heiser: Sure. My first was my grandfather. He was a kind of an unusual guy in that he was a super tall, like big guy and he was from the east coast and moved to the Midwest because my grandmother was from there and he was a little shocked at the non diversity of IO. And, um, so he became the president of the NAACP right around the big civil rights movement.
[00:26:13] Um, and he used to take me around with him all over the place. And I remember riding in the car with him and he'd start to talk about somebody. And I thought that he knew all of these people and he didn't but then he would say things like, yeah, that's, that's Mary over there. She's sitting on that park bench because you know, she's had a rough day or.
whatever.
And I was like, wow, how do you know all of this stuff? He's like, amazing. And then he'd be like, yeah, that guy, what countdown he looks that's like, he, he just got like chewed out by his wife and whatever, you know, he would make up these ridiculous stories that I, of course, as a five-year-old believed.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah.
Deborah Heiser: And it made the rides interesting.
But the lesson that he told me, he said, you never know anything about a person, really. You have to always know that there's something more inside of a person. Doesn't matter if they're sitting on a park bench, there's a [00:27:13] story to that person and there's something inside of them. And I never stopped looking at people as someone with a story, somebody with something that was interesting or complex or whatever. And that was one of the first things that made me really think of people as not just, know, Mary, but Mary was a story, something like that. And I thought that that was kind of cool. Um, he was my first mentor that I think I, I went into psychology because of him.
Rabiah (Host): Oh, that's fantastic.
Deborah Heiser: And, but the other part of that, that the other thing that he taught me was we used to go into restaurants and because he was the president of the NAACP in Des Moines, Iowa people were, didn't like him. It wasn't like we went in and people were like, "Hey, welcome." We got treated like garbage and pretty much every place we went to where they would say, we're not going to serve you.
Or we are going to [00:28:13] give you watered down orange juice or who knows what else they did, but um, that was how we were treated. And I used to be embarrassed by him. And I would think, I, you know, why can't you just not do what you're doing and being like a regular grandpa? And why do I have to come with you every Saturday to go through this?
And, um, he said to me, you know, it's, uh, you don't have to have lunch with everybody. You don't have to be liked by everybody and you can do what you're going to do. And you'll, you know, it's just a way that you're going to find out who your friends are, who your people are. And that took a while, but I understood that.
And that was a huge mentor moment was learning that.
Rabiah (Host): That's cool. And I mean, him realizing like, yeah, I know what this is.
Deborah Heiser: Yeah, I appreciate that. He took me around because I was not a pleasure to be with, you know?
I didn't [00:29:13] want to go with him. I was embarrassed by these interactions because I didn't understand it. And that to me showed me that, um, you know, he was a very strong character who was going to do what he needed to do to get change made, you know, things that he felt passionate about. and so that's why I feel like I can do that now.
Rabiah (Host): And then looking at founding The Mentor Project; so I understand like you had this, um, you know, you gained this knowledge about the importance of mentorship and also just people not having access, but there are many things you could have done with that information. So what made you decide to start The Mentor Project?
Because that's a pivot, right? That's a pivot going from a practice of the psychology to that. So can you talk a little bit about both of those things?
Deborah Heiser: What I was seeing with this pivot was a real need that was out there and not the need for the [00:30:13] mentees, but a need for the mentors to see that people had such strong emotional reactions and knowing that I would be able to have that too. There was some, you know, it wasn't purely altruistic. I want to get that feeling too.
And so that was one of the real reasons for the pivot. We don't look at The Mentor Project as the typical mentor projects where they're looking at just the outcomes for the mentees. We're looking at the mentor outcomes. What are they getting out of it and what are they doing? So now with this pivot, I'm able to take what I learned in psychology and what I can expect everyone to think and want.
And so now it's, it's kind of like, I couldn't think of it as a vacation job in a way, you know, I get to take all the good stuff and apply it to this and watch people have life changing experiences, which is kind of cool from the mentor perspective. Of course we know the mentees are going [00:31:13] to get something out of it, just like Ethan Gotian did and other mentees yet.
But the real thing is if you talk to Bob and you talk to Euro, they it's like they get to see the purpose and value and meaning and what they've been doing their whole lives come to fruition. It's kind of cool. So we I'm taking all of that psychology and I'm trying to get it to work so that we can maximize those awesome emotional experiences for all of the mentors as they are actually making change in the way.
Rabiah (Host): So how does someone become a mentor through you guys?
Deborah Heiser: So we have a pretty stringent onboarding where we do background checks and have people, you know, we really take a look. But people who want to give back, they can go to our website and email us, and then we will get back to them. And the process isn't [00:32:13] immediate. It has, it takes a couple of months, um, to get everything done because there's so many things that have to happen if you're working with kids, particularly around the world.
So, um, even if it's just over the camera, just to make sure that everybody's fine for working with kids. And then off we start, we go. And, part of the cool thing is that because we're mentor focused is we have weekly mentor meetups so the mentors who meet up, aren't just mentoring with the kids.
They're meeting up with colleagues so we'll get like an astrophysicist with a linguist who will then go do something. We had the chief learning officer of Cornell Columbia pair up with a linguist out in Nevada and they wrote a paper for Nature. Like they will never have had anything in common before.
We have a whole lot that's focused just on the mentor development and mentor, um, meetups and things like that that make it a lot of fun for them.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. And [00:33:13] who's the ideal mentor at this point, just in case someone's listening goes "Oh yeah. That's something I want to do."
Deborah Heiser: An ideal mentor is somebody who truly wants to be able to give back. Somebody who feels that they have an expertise in an area of. Science technology, engineering, arts, math, business, finance, or law. And you could convince me of another, which we could add if you wanted. We did just add an Olympian. If you have an expertise that you really feel you want to give back, that's one thing that, you know, give us, give us, uh, shoot us an email.
We're happy to talk with you. Some people want to get involved in different ways also. They want to do some of the, you know, sort of peripheral work that helps us to do some of the more administrative stuff. That's another way to get involved if you want to do that. And you still get to come and meet up with the other mentors.
So there are different ways people can get involved and use their skills and their expertise to give.
Rabiah (Host): Cool. [00:34:13] Is it always one-on-one mentorship ?
Deborah Heiser: No. So we're going to be doing a conference in April that will be for university students. So that's not one-on-one. We just did a group with students in India and they did a group project for us. We've done hackathons, which we've combined kids from different countries together who had not ever met before.
We do ask me anything sessions so those are all, this is because of the pandemic. We go into classrooms when it's not a pandemic and we do one-on-one. So Ethan was a one-on-one um, other students are one-on-one. If they have specific questions, our mentors will sometimes say, Hey, let's meet weekly.
Rabiah (Host): that's great. And just thinking about in the past, before you were doing this, did you have volunteerism or service as part of your life at all?
Deborah Heiser: Yeah. You know, I really believe in civic engagement as something that should start early because that is [00:35:13] really mentorship, volunteering, philanthropy. Those are all civic engagement. So it's getting you already prepared outside of yourself. So, yes, my, my parents had me out doing all kinds of things as a, as a young person, you know, mowing people's lawns, not for pay, but just to do it, going out and helping others in group or class activities, visiting people who needed to be visited those sorts of things that if you look back on it, know, I wouldn't have said that was so important, but it really was because it felt comfortable to go do it later.
It wasn't something that I felt awkward with.
Rabiah (Host): Well, and the thing is from my experience anyway, cause people sometimes I think are hesitant to do a simple thing like just go do a visit because they feel like, well, that's not doing that much, but to the person you're visiting, it's everything. I mean, that's the, that's the thing. Right? So then it's like, what's the impact to me [00:36:13] versus someone else? But sometimes it's more to them for sure.
Deborah Heiser: Yeah.
When I would visit in the assisted living facility, I actually probably had more fun than they did. I just had a blast running around to Wilbur's room and running around to everybody's, you know, area. It was just a social fest for me, but they would look forward to it because there weren't any other young people coming by really, and, they also got me to do a ton of chores for them. So
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, that's great. What's been the biggest impact to you personally.
Deborah Heiser: personally, I, I can only express it in that had an idea, you know that generativity and mentorship was important and everyone told me that I was crazy for thinking that anybody would ever want to do this. And I kept thinking, but it's it's something that's been written about. There's been theories about this.
It, it, there has to be something to it. [00:37:13] And I feel validated. I feel like that idea and what I had been learning about in books is really true out there. There's something really validating to me personally, that's very goes pretty deep because knowing that we all have this, that this is real, that what everybody was saying, wasn't there. Is really there that we are able to give back that we're built to want to do this, that we're not, you know, using older people to get things out of them that we're not younger. People are not a burden that we're not schmucks as older people like getting taken advantage of to help others. That it's really there.
So to me, that's the most powerful thing. It really feels like I had a purpose of my life in the sense that. I could go down this path and watch it happen.
Rabiah (Host): Let's. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, and one [00:38:13] other one other thing, just because you're my second guest to have done a TEDx Talk, which I understand is different than a TEDTalk. So, but it seems very much similar to me. So can you just talk a little bit about your experience doing that? And was it scary for you or how'd you get to.
Deborah Heiser: Um, scary is not even the right word for it. I actually became an adjunct professor because I was so scared to speak on the TEDx stage that I thought I better go get public speaking. Um, You know, like experience. I don't think that most people would go to that length, but I was that scared. I figured young people will ask anything and treat me badly and it couldn't get worse than like going out and having people do that.
So. It was incredibly scary, but there was a lot of support and I'm still really close with my TEDx coach, my speaking coach. They make you memorize it. [00:39:13] So I remember in the beginning when they were saying, oh, I thought I would get like a 20 minute thing. I thought it'd be great. And I, they gave me like seven minutes or something.
And I remember at the end thinking, I'm so glad it's seven minutes. I don't know how to memorize 20 minutes. And. I don't know that I could handle being up there for 20,
Rabiah (Host): Yeah.
Deborah Heiser: um, was so supportive. I have to say I had this grand idea and they, they essentially, it's such a humbling experience because they were like, no, that's a terrible idea.
Or I write something and I think it was great. And they'd be like, Oh, that's terrible. That's awful. Then they give me back. So it was just a life altering experience because everything, I thought that I was like, come in there with expertise. They were like "Boring. Terrible."
Rabiah (Host): Oh, my gosh.
Deborah Heiser: yeah. you have to come in ready to hear [00:40:13] and feel all of your, um, vulnerabilities being poked.
Rabiah (Host): yeah. Oh, I can see that. I mean, I do stand up comedy and so
Deborah Heiser: Oh, then you could do it. And like fi like that's harder.
Rabiah (Host): but yeah, it's weird because sometimes you just blank, you know, and I'm like, I've told this joke about 150 times. Why don't I know it? You know, all of a sudden, so.
Deborah Heiser: Yeah, cause you can't go up there with a PowerPoint and keep to your comedy.
Rabiah (Host): no, you do that. Uh, you'll get heckled, like, hold on. Let me set up my projector guys. No,
Deborah Heiser: And here are the steps that go with.
Rabiah (Host): Oh man. So D is there anything you wanted to cover that we didn't?
Deborah Heiser: I don't think anything else other than please, if people want with a mentor project, I will throw this out there.
We are a 100% free [00:41:13] volunteer organization. Everyone does everything, including myself for free. No, one's paid. Except our web guy gets a little bit, a tiny bit of money. But if people would like to donate, um, they're welcome to go to, uh, the website, mentor project dot org (mentorproject.org), check us out and please check out all of our free resources that we have.
I really would like people to it's all free. Go for it.
Go partake in anything.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, that's great. And I'll definitely be linking to it on the, on the show notes. So people will be able to find it anywhere. They're finding the podcast.
I have some questions that I ask every guest. But before that, just, if you have any last advice or mantra you want to share, some people have little things that they just like to share.
Deborah Heiser: Yeah. I'd like to just say that there's nothing better than giving the old adage to is better to give than to receive is actually true.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah.
Deborah Heiser: Every way it's been talked about
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. I a hundred percent agree with that. [00:42:13] Cool.
Rabiah (Host): So let's do the fun five. What is the oldest t-shirt you have and still wear?
Deborah Heiser: I, where it actually started out as my husband's t-shirt, it's from Webster Hall, from the 1990s and I wear it and it's absolutely hideous on me, but I proudly wear it all over because it's very comfortable.
Rabiah (Host): Awesome. That's great. Yeah. That's the thing about those old shirts they get into questionable states.
Deborah Heiser: Yeah, this one is.
Rabiah (Host): So if every day was really Groundhog's Day, and like you said, you've been to the opera now I've been to a play, but it's still, there's still a little bit of that feeling now. Um, what song would you have your alarm clock set to play every morning?
Deborah Heiser: Well, I currently have it set to a Bob Dylan song that I do not like. That one I don't like.
Rabiah (Host): Which one is.
Deborah Heiser: it's the one that goes I'm walkin... It's one that no one's heard of, no one's [00:43:13] listened to and I can't stand it. And I don't know the rest of the lyrics. Bob. Dylan's great. Just not this one
particular song. So anyway, he, uh, it gets to, I'm walking... and then I click it really fast and I'm up.
So just, I have to pick a song I don't like
Rabiah (Host): So it'd be that song. What is the song called? I don't even.
Deborah Heiser: oh, I'd have to look it up, but because I've only gotten past, I've never gotten past I'm walking in. So if people know that Bob Dylan they'll know that song,
Rabiah (Host): All right. I'll find it.
Deborah Heiser: it's like such a B track song
that no
Rabiah (Host): I'll track it down. Okay. Coffee or tea, or neither.
Deborah Heiser: Coffee for sure, I love it.
Rabiah (Host): What kind of, what's your favorite coffee or what, how do you take it usually?
Deborah Heiser: I get drip, I get cappuccino. I get, I no sugar. drink a black, I can drink it with some milk, [00:44:13] Um,
but never sugar.
Rabiah (Host): Okay, great. Yeah, I'm a coffee person too. And can you think of a time you laughed so hard you cried or something that just gets you going?
Deborah Heiser: Anything to do with farts. Yeah.
Like if there's a fart scene in a movie, I'll laugh. If there's, if someone walks by and farts, I'm going to laugh. I was in an exercise thing and it was really quiet and someone farted and I inappropriately rolled on the floor laughing, which was, but I couldn't help.
Rabiah (Host): It's so difficult. I, I was on a ghost tour, you know, like whatever in South Carolina with my friend in Charleston and the guy was trying to be creepy. So he kept saying things were creepy as though that was going to make them creepy, which it doesn't, right? A little guy is saying, yeah, it's very creepy.
And someone just ripped one so loud.[00:45:13]
I lost it. I lost it. I was like, I can't and me and my friend just, you know, it's so ridiculous. The tour was awful, but that was the best. Like I should have TripAdvisor reviewed it and said the fart was the best part of that tour.
Deborah Heiser: See, I can just hear about it. I'm going to laugh.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. You've just, you know, I've just validated that you find that funny,
so, Oh, okay. And the last one who inspires you right now?
Deborah Heiser: Well, um, I'm inspired by you, you're doing a podcast. So right now I'm inspired by you at this very moment.
Rabiah (Host): thanks.
Deborah Heiser: and so you're right up there with my very, the very first inspiring person that I ever acknowledged being inspired by was Marie Curie. Um, I just think she rocked it. She was such a cool person and, uh, she still holds it for me.
She's still my, my all time.
Rabiah (Host): That's cool.
Deborah Heiser: [00:46:13] Inspiration.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah.
Awesome. All right. Well, and so we've already said, but just repeat one more time, where can people find well, if they want to find you, where would you prefer? They go and then also. Website for the mentor project.
Deborah Heiser: Uh, you can check me out on LinkedIn, Deborah Heiser, I'm there. But if you wanted to go to, um, the website for The Mentor Project, you can, first of all, find us on all social media. The Mentor Projecxt. But if you want to go to our website, it'smentor project dot org (mentorproject.org) and don't hesitate to contact us to go through the, our contact button.
We do answer everybody who, who puts anything in there. So feel free.
Rabiah (Host): Cool. Well, Debbie, thanks so much. It's been great talking to you. I really appreciate you sharing all this.
Deborah Heiser: You know, this has been a real pleasure. You're an amazing host. I had a really fun time talking with you. And so thank you. It's been a privilege.
Rabiah (Host): Thanks again for listening this week. You can find out [00:47:13] more about the guest in the shownote and at rabiah said dot com (rabiahsaid.com). Joe Maffia created the music just for this podcast. Find him on Spotify. That's Joe M A F F I A. And Rob Metke is responsible for our visual design. You can find him online by searching for Rob M E T K E. Thanks, Rob.
Let me know who you'd like to hear from or about your own experiences to finding yourself outside of work, follow at more than work pod, or send a message on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, or LinkedIn, or visit our website more than work. pod.com. Give us a follow on Spotify, apple, or wherever you get your podcasts and leave a review.
If you like. Thanks for listening to More Than Work. While being kind to others, don't forget to be kind to yourself.
