S5E2 - JC Hurtado-Prater
This week’s guest is JC Hurtado-Prater, leadership enthusiast and business professor. He teaches at Point Loma Nazarene University and Azusa Pacific University. He is also the author of four personal development books and is working on a fifth. And he is a consultant.
Prior to his current roles, JC worked in the non-profit space and in the ministry. He was also in the US Army which is where he first learned about leadership and the importance of focusing on the mission ahead. He shared insights on transitioning out of the military and into the private sector.
A dynamic personality, JC shares his opinions on many subjects. We talk about :
Leadership and how people who are managers don’t always learn to be good leaders.
The importance of understanding an organization before going in and trying to change it.
How crucial therapy is to one’s own development including as a leader. He is even writing a book about his own experience.
A pivotal moment 10 years ago when he read Warren Bennis’ “On Becoming a Leader” which has formed his ideas today
The professor who changed his life through encouraging words and making him realize the he too could be like other members of his family and become a professor or educator
JC also has a podcast, called JC Talks: A Leadership Podcast with JC Hurtado-Prater. We chat about a subject that comes up there which is about people’s character. He believes that people can change their character with self-awareness and delves into Ray Dalio’s philosopy around radical truth and radical transparency, and the Importance of letting people in an organization be honest with the leaders.
Note from Rabiah (Host):
This is a really special episode because first of all, the intro was recorded with video so you’ll see me on YouTube. But also, the guest was incredible. I had a blast with him and we had some major laughs but also got into some real issues. It was hard not to be 100% positive with JC though. We did delve into tragic loss and the importance of honouring others as we continue in our lives. I appreciated the opportunity to talk about that. In fact, JC gave me a chance to speak quite a bit. It was one of those conversations where I could have given in and not been the host but we had a good balance. Enjoy!
TW: death by substance overdose
Rabiah and JC chatting and laughing. He’s in San Diego and she’s in London but did visit SD over the holidays!
Find JC
Mentioned on the episode
Leaders Eat Last by Simon Senak
Warren Bennis, “On Becoming a Leader”:
Transcript
Rabiah (Host): [00:04:13] This is More Than Work, the podcast reminding you that your self worth is made up of more than your job title. Each week, I'll talk to a guest about how they discovered that for themselves. You'll hear about what they did, what they're doing and who they are. I'm your host, Rabiah. I work in IT, perform standup comedy, write, volunteer, and of course podcast. Thank you for listening.
Hey everyone. So I'm trying something new this week and recording on video as well as audio for the intro to the podcast. And this will be posted on YouTube. I don't really know if it's going to be much to watch because it's going to be me looking around, trying not to look at my notes, trying not to look in the camera like a weirdo and just you know,
trying to say that the beginning part of this thing, but anyway, uh, trying to do video [00:05:13] this this year, if I can, in some parts and, uh, I'm excited to try it. Uh, Squadcast has both video and audio capabilities. And though I don't think I can edit video all the time. I'm going to try it for at least the intro.
So one thing it tells me is I do need a background of some sort, uh, and you'll see why, if you see it. Those of you who are not watching, you're going to hear the same thing anyway. So this week's guest is JC Hurtato-Prater. He's... it was fun. Uh, I had, I had a fun time just listening back and we laughed a lot.
We laughed over each other a lot and that's really cool, but we got into serious subjects. So I will have one possible trigger. Warning is we do talk about. Um, death by a substance overdose. And we don't talk about it for very long, but it's something that's there. So if, if that's something that you are in a place where you can listen to, then, then please just, you know, maybe skip this one and listen to the [00:06:13] first part of it or something, but not the whole thing, because.
From my experience that that can be hard at different times, but, uh, we talked about it in a way that I really appreciated because I got to talk a little bit about the experience of kind of stepping away after that happens to someone you're close to and how you can deal with that. And one thing that was cool about this talk with JC is I had to watch it because I thought he was going to take over the interview a few times because he would ask me what I thought of things.
And so I talk a lot more than usual in this interview, but also, um, I usually, I intentionally I will give my 2 cents on something, but then step away because the point is to highlight the person's story, not my story. Otherwise I could do a solo episode every week, but in this case, that's how JC, I think we're very similar in how we talk to people and talk with people and so
we liked each other's stories. I would, I would love to talk to him again just personally or [00:07:13] something cause I think he's a lot of fun and I almost wish, um, I would live near to him because we just had a good time and I think we could collaborate on some things. But anyway, he works in leadership. He's a professor, but he's works in like leadership and business.
And so it was really just great to talk to him about that subject. It's a subject that's very close to mine. And I like getting all the different perspectives of different people who, who do talk leadership. Um, I think I'll just leave it at that. It's for me, it was fun. I hope you enjoy it. I really want to get feedback from people on these episodes and what they think, and please share, and it'll just keep, make it easier for me to keep going with the podcast
if you share. With friends and stuff on different episodes that you like, but I hope people enjoy this one and we'll see how this video turns out. I'm a little nervous, but thanks for listening again.
Rabiah (Host): My [00:08:13] guest this week is JC Hurtado-Prater. He's a leadership enthusiast and a business professor, and we're going to get into what else he does and who he is. So thanks for being here, JC.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Rabiah, it's so good to be here. You know, seriously, I've been looking forward to this. This is great.
Rabiah (Host): Me too. So first let's just go ahead and introduce yourself a little bit to the audience and where I'm talking to you from.
JC Hurtado-Prater: You know, it's interesting when you said that in the in the email the other day, I thought, it really led to kind of a crisis. Who am I? Right? So you really did. And I actually processed that a little bit. So I am JC, as you shared and I think if I had to just dispel what I'm passionate about I think I wrote that I'm a leadership enthusiast and I really am.
I could talk about this all day. I also teach business for Point Loma Nazarene University, their school of business, and then Azusa Pacific University, their school of business and management. I do consulting. There's a little firm that I work with here that's based out of La Jolla. I'm trying to build my own company, my own training company.
A speaker this morning, talk about this idea of [00:09:13] focus and all of this for me, centers around this idea of healthy leaders develop healthy organizations. I really believe that. That's a long introduction, but I'm just passionate about growing leaders. That's who I am.
Rabiah (Host): That's great because I think people assume different things about leadership
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes.
Rabiah (Host): right?
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes.
Rabiah (Host): and that, well, they're a natural leader. They're not. They can't lead. They're a bad manager because they're not a leader, but maybe they're actually a good leader, but but bad man..., you know, stuff like that.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Absolutely. You know, so the other day on Monday, I was in a meeting with this group that I'm working with. CENTAURIC, is the management consulting firm. And I'm surrounded by all these brilliant people, PhDs and all this and we're talking about organizational development, leadership.
And Jeanette and I'm going to get her last name wrong so I won't try to say it, she said the reason why organizations are so unhealthy are because people at their core, everyone is insecure, right? [00:10:13] And so this idea of leadership, you know, kind of what you're talking about,
it's about moving people forward, helping people to help the organization move forward, right? But because you're dealing with people and they're all insecure, we all, all right. I
have my own share of securities, right? I've got things that I try to hide and stuff. So, because we're all insecure, that's what makes the organization gets messy.
So, so leadership, it's not like this one, 7, 8, 9, 10 steps. It's different for different people, different organizations, different contexts. So you're exactly right. And then, you know, management, that's a whole different world as well.
So it's a much trickier thing than what, you know, a lot of people think leadership and I think it's an easy concept.
It's Alexander the Great, taking down the wall or whatever. And it's just, it's so much more than that. And I think that's why I'm so passionate.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, for sure. And I think I've even noticed with myself, and I've studied a lot about leadership, just for personal, like interest and out of personal interest. And I'm, I'm doing a Public Leadership Credential at Harvard Kennedy right now. So learning from [00:11:13] that, you know, a ton, but like one thing they said is keep the problem at the center, not yourself and
JC Hurtado-Prater: so good. That's good. That's something we talked about and I want to come back to that real quick. We talked about Harvard, cause I want to know what you're learning there cause that's, that's phenomenal. But to say something; one of the things we talked about the other day, and this is what I think we get wrong with leadership. Not wrong but it's it's why people like me exist. Because it's so messy because people are messy and they're insecure and they're, you know, we're dysfunctional. And I found in every facet- I've been in the nonprofit world, the government space- but now that I'm moving into the for-profits to it's everywhere because people are messy, everywhere.
Right. But the one thing that we talked about the other day, the most important thing, I think for leaders, we have to keep the mission first, right? If that comes, I was in a conversation last night with the team and we were trying to make decisions about who to bring on the team. And, and I had to just finally say, okay, what's the mission?
Where are we going, right?
And that cleared it up for everyone once they understood that. [00:12:13] But let me ask you, what are you learning through Harvard about leadership? Because they have such an academic way of looking at it. What's something that you've, you've taken away from that experience?
Rabiah (Host): So the program I'm in has two leadership courses, two public policy design, and two like empirical analysis. And so I finished the leadership courses and it really had a huge impact on me because the biggest thing I realized was that whole thing about pulling yourself out of it and also assessing and understanding the culture where you're at.
A lot of them are talking about NGO type work and stuff, but even in an organization, understanding the norms. So basically don't come in and say, well, this is what works for me, and this is my background, so that's what you're doing.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes in that something that even at Harvard, because that's like, that's the, that's the meat of it. That's what gets leaders in trouble all the time, right? They come into organizations, they they're trying to change it too quickly, or, you know, they don't know what the call. Most [00:13:13] people get fired as nothing to do with their hard skills. It's always the soft skills. They don't understand the culture. They don't understand the norms. They're trying to force. So isn't that something that Harvard business school is even talking about this and working for NGOs, that this is something that they're discussing? That, that, honestly, that surprises me.
Rabiah (Host): Well, yeah cause we did case studies about, you know, people going into, like, there was this one about Cambodia and just to do with, you know, understanding even how healthcare works and how family relationships and culturally, how things go and stuff like that. Because for us, you know, in the states, we have a certain way of doing things and it wouldn't work somewhere else because they don't have the same responsibilities to each other or they have more responsibilities to each other.
I don't remember the exact use case. I just remember like reading all of it and going, oh yeah, that resonated.
JC Hurtado-Prater: You know what? And it's so true because when you're talking about what you're talking about in America, if I move from California, Arizona, I [00:14:13] don't have to relearn an entire new culture. I have to learn the organizational culture. But when you go, you working for an NGO, I mean, you're talking about you're going into different countries, right? So not only you have to learn the organizational culture, you've got to learn the community culture, the the culture of the country, right?
And I'm guessing that probably gets people in trouble too.
Rabiah (Host): I would. I think so. Yeah. Like they're not going to, they might not be making the impact that they want to make.
JC Hurtado-Prater: They're bringing that westernized mindset into other cultures. That's one thing that I appreciate that is happening more like, like, like I, I have a church background and so a lot of churches, especially the evangelical churches, they've had this mentality of most of them are white,
right? I'm not trying to say anything, but it's just the fact. And most of them have this mentality of let's go to Mexico or let's go to Cambodia or let's go to Africa let's help them be more like us, right? And if you think about it, that's so far away from what leadership is because leadership is, like you said, it's going into organizations and cultures, learning who they [00:15:13] are first and helping them figure out how do we help you rise to the next level. It's not about how do we take my mentality, this westernized mentality, and go to you and figure out how we can turn you into who we are. It's how do you learn the people right where they are. And that's, that's what you have to do as a manager in an organization as well. Especially if you're coming in new.
Not this idea of changing. I guess I'm saying all this, because leadership is not rocket science,
but it also is rocket science. Because everything we're talking about it makes sense on paper, but. Why don't people get it? Why do we have so many bad managers out there? Right. Why do people like me exist?
Because there's so many people that struggle in this era of leadership and management.
Rabiah (Host): Well, there's variances, right? So you can like a rocket scientist. I mean, I wouldn't presume to know a lot about their job, but
say you plan for a rocket launch in perfect conditions, perfect atmospheric conditions, but then some freaky. Comes across, or maybe the wind, the wind probably at a very low velocity will affect it.
Well, it's the same with like a leader going in. [00:16:13] Maybe I actually started so I can tell you. So I started at a company as like a Director of Operations or some,
yeah.
And the first day I got there, the one guy called in sick. Didn't have my laptop ready or anything. On my team. One person was on vacation.
That was fine. The other leaders weren't there. It was just like I walked in and it was clear no one wanted me there, right? And so I went in with this intention of, oh, this is how I'm going to do things. And I quickly had to assess it and say, nope, that's not how I'm doing things. I'm going to do things this way now.
JC Hurtado-Prater: What, what made you change?
Rabiah (Host): Well, I just, I understood that everyone was excited I was coming and they were ready and, and then what I found out was, well, the one guy, one of my jobs, so he just didn't show up to work that day.
JC Hurtado-Prater: You're kidding me. So he was upset because he didn't get it, so
his act of defiance was I'm just not going to be there?
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. And you know what he was hurt. And
so
JC Hurtado-Prater: sure. [00:17:13]
Rabiah (Host): you know, I just kind of at that point, saw that, and I
JC Hurtado-Prater: How did you handle that? Cause this is what we're talking about. Like a dysfunctional, unhealthy leader would have handled that in a really negative way. How, how did you handle that with this guy, cause obviously he came back at some point, right?
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. You know, I, oddly enough, I had gone through something at two companies before that where I started in my boss started a week after and he had not gotten a chance to talk to me before. He didn't get to choose me or anything. And he treated me really badly. And then he had no compassion from where I was coming later, when there was, there were problems. And he would bring people in and just kind of, well, this guy is doing this now and slowly chip away at my job. And so I realized, first of all, I would never do that. I mean, I've learned more from bad leaders than good sometimes,
JC Hurtado-Prater: we do, right?
Rabiah (Host): yeah, because it was just like, I'm not going to let someone feel this.
So this guy was hurt. That was the thing I got. [00:18:13] I wasn't mad just because I thought, yeah, that probably sucks. You know, that's a bummer. And I've been in a position where I didn't get a job. I wanted. I don't know. I mean, I didn't handle everything well, and I certainly don't. I mean, I have a bit of a temper sometimes and stuff, but
JC Hurtado-Prater: same, yeah.
Rabiah (Host): sometimes if you can just remove yourself from it, like, I struggle with that now.
I mean, you know, removing myself from it and I get feedback or get suggestions from people and I take it personally and then I have to like, get rid of that emotion because that wasn't what they were doing. They weren't saying you should have done this two years ago when you weren't even here, they're saying this is something we need.
So,
JC Hurtado-Prater: yeah, yeah. yeah. See how it's the small, like, that's it, but it's not a small issue, right? Like on paper, that would be like, oh, like that's not profit and loss. That's not merger and acquisition. That's not, you know, hard skills, but that right there, that instance right there that could, that can make or break an entire team, right? Or mission.
Rabiah (Host): yeah, for sure.
[00:19:13] So
JC Hurtado-Prater: leadership's about.
Rabiah (Host): it is, I agree. And I think one thing I know about you is that you were in the Army.
JC Hurtado-Prater: I was, yes.
Rabiah (Host): And previously I had this guest named B Kyle and she was in the Army and she talked a lot about leadership too. And she's doing a different career than you are, but she talked a lot about leadership and that was where she learned it was in the Army.
So can you talk a little bit about the Army and
JC Hurtado-Prater: Absolutely. Yeah.
they, I will tell you this, two ways that I think I've learned probably more than my education that it prepared me for the real world and the marketplace; waiting tables and serving in the military.
Waiting tables, obviously it's customer service.
I think everyone should wait tables for two years. Everybody should. Cause you learn and you never treat a waiter bad ever again. So, so that's that like, how do you treat people? How do you you know, customer service, sales, all that? But the Army, I will tell you. Man. There's so many things that I could say about the military.
Coming back to what we talked about earlier, it's it's mission focus, right? [00:20:13] I think of anything, this is an organization where your feelings don't matter. It was hard for me coming out of the military after four years and walking into an organization where people were like, I need to take a mental health day. Like that was hard because I think that's like what the are you talk of a mental, what is that? What's a mental health day the military? And obviously the military is not forfor everyoned they have to run that way because it's about combat at, at, at
the heart of it's about combat. But they were so mission-focused and if you couldn't get the mission done, that's you right out of the way.
And they're going to find the right person, right team, whatever. And I've had to learn to come back from that a little bit, because again, the corporate world, the real world, the nonprofit world, especially does not work that way at all. It's very much feelings and people and you got to sit and listen, and that's all part of this.
There's the leadership. But I think the most important thing that I learned in the military is that the mission all. Comes first. It's always about that. Right? And for them in the military, [00:21:13] that's what it's about. I don't care what your feelings are. If we get ready to take that hill, and I'm gonna have to worry about how you're feeling about this.
And then the other guys come across the hill and they ended up, you know, bombing the crap out of us or whatever. It's not gonna, you know, like your feelings don't matter. It's about getting the mission done. So I think I learned that, but I also learned the military is big on if you're in a position of leadership, the only way you get the mission done is you have to take care of your people.
So at the heart of it, and I remember they would train up and coming leaders and sergeants and, you know, team leaders that when your people are and I was never in battle, I never went to war, but we did a lot of training, like field training exercises. So you would simulate this act of war. So when people are training, The team leader is running back and forth behind,
right? You know, do you have your weapons? Do you have your animal? Do you have the food that you need you? So they're constantly worried about how do I take care of my people so they can do the mission? So I think that's another great leadership trait I learned as well is that leadership is not actually doing the job.
It's making sure that the [00:22:13] people who are doing the job of resource to do the job. So, I mean, I could give so many lessons there, but the military is, it's leadership intensive and it probably is the greatest place where I've been that you just see it all around you. It's so ingrained in the culture and what we're trying to do.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah.
JC Hurtado-Prater: They're trying to do
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. And that that's very similar to what she was saying. Like there was this book "Leaders Eat Last" or
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes. Exactly. Exactly. Yes. Yeah.
And I have, and then you come into corporate America or non-pro, and I remember one of the first places I went and I saw the, this the CEO or the executive director. It was like a lunch and they were first in line. I was like, I, that doesn't register. Even to this day, I could never, ever. And it's not because I'm better than anyone else or anything like that.
But when I see a leader who's first in line or, or, okay, here's a key lesson for your listener to hope they get this. This is one of the greatest lessons I've learned. I think I learned this from a book. Leaders should never be the first to [00:23:13] speak in a meeting. They should eat last and they should speak last.
So you come into a meeting and you sit down and you have this big vision. You have this idea about where the organization needs to go and what, what do most leaders do? So here's the thing. Here's what we need to, you know, you know, we need more creativity, more innovation, whatever it is. And so here's what I think we need to do.
What do you all think and what does everyone around the table do cause they want to get along with the leader they go around,
"Yes. Yes, boss, yes." And there's one contrarion. No one likes that person. So they get shut down as opposed to the leader saying, "okay, here's the end goal. Here's what we need to get to."
And maybe he, or she has a clear idea in their head, but they say, "Hey team, I've hired all of you. I trust all of you. What are you offering? How do we reach this?" And then when everyone else is spoken, I'm going to write a book about that.
You just gave me the idea of Leaders Eat Last, but I'm going to write one called Leaders Speak Last.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah.
JC Hurtado-Prater: idea.
And that that's one thing that I've had to learn how to do. Cause cause you and I are talkers, right?
So I can talk anyone under [00:24:13] the table, but I've had to learn when I go into meetings, shut your trap, man. I'm talking to myself, right? Shut your mouth and put out the mission or vision and let everybody else talk because I will tell you this, you can pay people all the money you want. You can give them all the little rewards you want. People want to be listened to. They want their ideas to be valued. And I've learned this in life. And this is what gets most leaders in trouble and why people are constantly leaving. Managers especially because they're not listening to their people to that. value in what they have to say.
So yes, leaders eat last and leaders speak last in my opinion.
Rabiah (Host): I really liked that. I really liked that.
And I
JC Hurtado-Prater: I do too. I'm going to have to give you credit. Like we'll have to go half and half on this book.
That's going to be a great book,
Rabiah (Host): I've always wanted to write a book. So let's talk about books actually. So we're just going to bounce around, but then we'll get to. You know, get to where we're going on this podcast too, but you are an author. So can you talk a little bit about, I mean, I don't think every conversation you have, you just go home and write a book and then you write that book like we just had right now.
But how did you come [00:25:13] to decide that one way you were going to express your ideas and do this was via books?
JC Hurtado-Prater: That's really good. And I want to tell you that all of my books are crap. So I'm going to say that right now. I don't recommend any of your listeners. If someone's listening right now, don't go by them. So, and, and I'm still forming, I now I'm much more focused on kind of where I'm going, but I will tell you this.
Here's what I found in. And even the books I've written, all four of them have been written for me really, right. There are things that I've wanted to get to know, and I wanted to do better and I'm actually going. One more. I think it's okay to share this with you. I am I've done the last almost eight years.
I've been, I I've been in therapy and it's been the most. I have grown as a person and I've grown as a leader. More people, more leaders need to find themselves on the therapist's couch and you're shaking your head. So obviously like
you understand this as well, right?
Rabiah (Host): Oh, absolutely.
JC Hurtado-Prater: that's what hinders most organizations is the personal issues of the leader.
Right?
Rabiah (Host): Yeah.
JC Hurtado-Prater: So, so right now, I, [00:26:13] I'm trying to dispel eight years of wisdom from my therapist. Her name is Jeannie and I don't know where I'd be without her. So I'm looking at so we meet, we used to meet every Thursday. Now we meet Fridays that's that's who I was meeting before I
came on with you. And so I'm thinking about calling it Thursdays with genie seven life and leadership lessons from the therapist, counselor, or something like that and everything that she's taught me.
So you talked about this idea of books. Why I write them, and I know everyone has a different reason, I like to touch and feel and be in the room with people who have meetings more, but books helped me process out my thoughts, right? So when I'm trying to figure out how do you figure out a person's purpose or how do you figure out great character?
The best way for me is well just write a book and then I'm going to have to study it and study it and study it. And I'm going to put it on. Now, going forward again, I'm going to write this last kind of personal development book and then my company Cannonball, I've got a lot of material next year and just for the next 40 years of my life, I'll be writing a ton in terms of culture and leadership, and how do you have an all-in [00:27:13] culture? How do you have an all-in team and all in life? Right. So that's where I'm gonna go with it, but I've got one more book in me that I want to write that's more personal development and it's, it's from the lessons I've learned from, from, from a genie. And I will tell you it's it's if it weren't for her, my own leadership, my own teaching, how I approach.
You know, the students that I I'm able to teach, none of that would be, I think, where it is today. And I have a lot of growth, you know, for sure. But none of that would be where it is today if it weren't for the work that I've done with her for eight years.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. I mean, I, I completely relate with that because even what I said, like people just giving me certain, like me processing things, I'll talk to my therapist about it. So my therapist, I mean, she knows like there's going to be like a workweek. There's going to be a personal week, you know, whatever. But it's, it's important because I think when I see how I'm treating other people and I don't feel good about it,
JC Hurtado-Prater: yes.
Rabiah (Host): then I'm the one that needs to change. They don't because I want them to keep coming to me. I want them to keep [00:28:13] talking to me, so I have to do something so that it's safe for them to do that. You know, that's how I feel.
JC Hurtado-Prater: No, it's great. And I remember even in one of the classes I was teaching this past summer, we had this guy, so I teach graduates and undergraduates and, and the undergrads are all great. Cause they all think you're amazing cause they're undergrads and they don't know any better. The graduates know better.
And some of the graduates that I teach are actually 10 years older than I am. And we had one who's retired military. I hope he doesn't listen to this. And he'll probably know what I'm talking about, but he's a great student, right? Incredible student. But he would just, he was devil's advocate on everything and would dominate the conversation on everything.
But, and so I remember at one point. We, we, our conversation and I, and I like to teach kind of like how you doing, you know, right now, where if someone has a point that they want to talk about, we go there, right? And my job is to always get us back to where we need to get to, but
I'll like, we'll go on tangents.
Whatever's best for the students. So we were going off and he made this comment. He said, "Excuse me. We're actually supposed to be talking about this" and he was right. We needed to get back on focus. And then you [00:29:13] said a couple of other things. And I remember getting I was pissed to be honest with you. I was really upset because that guy was hijacking my class, but then two or three days later, I bring that up in therapy because I was so upset about it.
And my therapist says, "Hey, you know what? Knock it off. Like, you've got a strong-willed person in your classroom who's got a lot of experience, has something they want to. It's not him that needs to change you. You need to change your mindset. And how do you begin to empower him and how do you", and I'll tell you, he became one of my favorite students because I learned to change my own mindset around him, as opposed to getting insecure about the fact that he had a lot to say and could hijack the class.
Now it was, how do I empower him and how do I almost get on his side? Right? Because the
class kind of followed him and, and, so it, it goes back to what you're saying. It's it's, if I take that personal, I'm going to be. Last thing. I was watching this, this, this video yesterday came up on my feed and there was this professor in a class, and this is a huge class and someone Young's really loud class.
I wish, I wish [00:30:13] we could show this video, this lab, yo or whatever. And the professor stops. And for two minutes, yells at the entire class because someone yawned and he was going up. You tell me who did it right now? Who is it? And I'll keep you all in here till you all tell me. And finally, someone lied and said it was someone outside,
but this is what I'm talking about.
This is all the comments you can imagine were amazing on that video. They were
like, who hurt this man?
All the. But you're talking about a really insecure professor who someone yawns in class, and you're going to get upset about that people yawn, right? That that's a natural part of life. And so, you know, I think we have to be held and we've got to take care of that, those mental health aspects of who we are, or we're going to be like that Jack, the professor yelling at a bunch of people for something that doesn't matter at all.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. Oh, that's so that's so wild. So looking at you spend time in the army and then you got out and you went into like nonprofit space and those kinds of things, the other industries, and now [00:31:13] you're in for profit. Plus you went into being a pastor at some point. So all those things. So I guess what I'm curious about is really first of all. Cause I mean, this podcast, a lot of it is about not defining yourself by your job title, but how, how did you navigate what you wanted to do and switching out of the army and then navigate what you wanted to do next and kind of get to where you are?
JC Hurtado-Prater: Such a great question. Yeah, no, that's a really great question. I'll tell you, I'm still on this journey, right? I'm still in the train and I think I'm more focused today than ever, but it's taken me years. I probably got distracted a lot, you know. It's going to sound like a humble brag, but it's not, but when you, but when you can do many things, you try to do many things and the problem is you don't get focused in, on one or two things that I could be really great at. And I would say this I went into non-profit and church ministry because that's all I'd known. Like growing up probably the church saved me in a lot of ways, right family, and that's a whole nother issue. You know, that's the only other conversation, but I think I just had this [00:32:13] fondness for the church world because it really was my foundation growing up.
And really, it did save me in a lot of ways. And so I think I found that after I got out of the military, but I always knew. The first book that I read when I was a kid, I think I was 12 or 13 and Lee Iacocca who used to be the chairman of Chrysler. And he was a big celebrity back in the eighties. And I read his book like 12 and I was like, oh my gosh, this is what I want to do.
I was so passionate about it. And But then fear got in the way I knew it was normal. I think I was scared of the marketplace. And so for many years, I just kind of, you know, I did the non-profit space, the church world, which I gotta be honest with you was actually amazing because I I'm, I'm going to tell you right now, if you want to learn how to lead people, go lead a bunch of volunteers in a church who could tell you to shove it anytime they want to.
And they will, right.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah,
JC Hurtado-Prater: They put, you know, you're on our payroll, we pay your salary. You want to learn how to lead people. That's probably been the greatest foundations leaders, a bunch of volunteers who could walk at any time. [00:33:13] So I did that for for many years and it's been an amazing, I got to work in small churches.
I spent four years in a mega church where they had a $20 million a year budget and the senior pastor who's still there. He's been there 40 years now. He has his own ministry, I guess you call it her nonprofit. The average is about 75 million a year. So this
is a guy who was very driven, he's influential.
He speaks and talks and he influences a lot of people. So working for him was really great because I got to see what it means to be disciplined. He writes one or two books a year, and I got to see what that looks like, what that takes to do that. And so I say I had a great time, but through all of this, I knew that I had this passion to get in the marketplace and to work with marketplace leaders.
Because again, going back to this idea of people are dysfunctional and insecure in every walk of life. So how do I get into the marketplace and help and add value? And, and that's, that's the next 40 or 40 years of my life. We're going to be teaching future business leaders and helping marketplace leaders.
That's all my life's going to be about.[00:34:13]
Rabiah (Host): Thanks for walking me through that because that's good to see just kind of how you transitioned into it, cause I was kind of the opposite last year where I was thinking about, oh, I should go into nonprofit because I really want to serve.
And I feel like that's a core value of mine is
service, but then I realized part of service will be having something to give.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes.
Rabiah (Host): So I need to stay in my corporate role so I have more to give.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes. Yes. A lot of that's such a great point and there's so many, I sit on nonprofit boards, so I have to be careful what I say here. But you make a really good point. A lot of people think, let me just get in the nonprofit space and then I can serve, but they don't realize it's kind of the same, cause it becomes a job then, right?
Like I'm, I'm helping teens now. It's, you're there eight to five every day and it becomes a job you're, you know, doing it and you're not even making as much money. Now, there's some people who are really gifted to do that and they need to do that. Right. It's good. But one of the things I found. Sitting on, on nonprofit boards, you know, who has the most influence in the room?
It's the [00:35:13] person with the most money, right?
The person with the most power or the person with the most money. And this is where I decided I remember sitting in a room and I said, how can I be more influential here? It all comes back to dollars and cents. The CEO. Yes, you can come volunteer for a day and help a kid or two, but that, that doesn't, that's not going to move the nonprofit forward.
What does it is marketplace acceptance, marketplace success. And then you're able to hand a check of $25,000 to a non-profit or 5,000 or 10, or, you know, help, help them generate more funds to bring more attention to them. That's what actually makes a greater difference. And there will be people who would disagree with me so much.
I know they will. But I'm telling you, I've been in the nonprofit space enough. I've sat in the boardrooms. If you want to make the greatest difference in the nonprofit world, make that money, you know what I'm saying? And then add value to other people,
Rabiah (Host): Right.
JC Hurtado-Prater: So I think you're smart to stay where you are and then just donate.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. And that was through conversations with a couple of leaders and a few people and just realizing, and
JC Hurtado-Prater: And what did they say
Rabiah (Host): well, one of them that was the [00:36:13] most influential me. So she's the CEO of ic stars and founder co-founder
and they're an awesome organization and her name's Sandy Kastrul. So then we can hear that episode, but she helped me realize a couple of things.
Cause I was thinking of going to grad school, doing all this stuff. That's how I ended up in the Harvard program,. Right? Because I did all this assessment, I wrote a blog about it. I'm like, kinda like you, I, I was thinking it through and I put it down. I thought, well, here or someone else might like this too.
Right. But anyway, what Sandy explained to me, it was a couple of things. One, I do have gifts to give now I don't have to get a hundred thousand dollar degree or over in the UK, it would be £20K. And you know, just get to know a nonprofit, if you think that's where you want to work, go volunteer and you'll find out more about the organization.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes.
Rabiah (Host): Then you will otherwise. But then she also encouraged me, like, if I want to, if I do want education, find where. And so she encouraged me with the program I'm in, because I think it'll make me a stronger non-profit board member. And another friend told me [00:37:13] Rabiah, you need to make sure you can take care of yourself.
And part of that is continuing to earn your income. And she said, you can serve on a board and probably bring more to the table than you would if you're in their office. And so those were the
JC Hurtado-Prater: Absolutely. Yes, I think, and that's all great advice. You're right. I think people think, let me quit my job and go make, you know, 13 bucks an hour. And here in the United States, that's not, it sounds like a lot for maybe some parts of our country, but in a, in a lot of, well, I mean, you've been in the states, so, you know, like 13 bucks an hour is not going
to make you much
Rabiah (Host): I lived in, I went to UC San Diego
JC Hurtado-Prater: Okay, so you all, okay. So you've lived here in San Diego So you
understand 13 bucks an hour is nothing, right? Back in Indiana where I'm from, that's something decent, but it's still not going to get you anywhere.
But you, you, you, again, there are some people who are designed to do that and they're, they're like they need to be in the nonprofit space.
That's, it's a great job for them. It fits. They're kind of the rescuers. They need a little drama in there. Right. And every day they get to be rescuing people on an actual basis. Other people though, I think like what you're saying, you could serve on a [00:38:13] board and you're exactly right. There's so much more influence that you can be for the, you know, for the organization and more money that you can bring into organization in those positions of influence.
You know, both are important. Right. And I don't want to
knock the person who's down on the ground, but I, I so agree with that advice that you got.
Yeah,
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. You just have to do, to me is I think all of us are capable of giving in some way and not everyone's capable of being on a board either, right? Or that's not what their interest is, but. And then some people are volunteers. I mean, I'm like a lifelong volunteer and that's so important. So yeah, it's just, everyone's kind of in the position that best serves them and they can serve others in it.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yeah.
I, I think the, the mentality and this has taken me, honestly, probably too long to learn, you know, this has been my own journey through leadership and I'm so glad because I found it. I found this path and this is why I'm so passionate about it in 2011. So I've been on this for 10 years now. I was such a bad leader and I was running the team was actually going to church [00:39:13] and my goal was to build this thing.
And you know, I was leading a music program and I wanted to build it and become large and one of the largest in the nation and, and it just wouldn't grow. And it was through a series. I actually went through a broken engagement. So, this is in the span of three months, a broken engagement. I got pulled over on the eight in San Diego here because my car, my registration was expired and I'd been pulled over two weeks before.
And the guy said, okay, you need to get this done. But I lack of leadership, lack of self-leadership. I was like, I'll take care of it whenever. I got pulled over again, two weeks later, and then they impounded my car. And I'm walking
home from the 8 to Mission Valley where I lived by myself cause I, I tried to call people.
No one could. So it was those two things. And then there was something else. And this team I was trying to grow just wa it just kept decreasing. And I found myself in a situation where I was in the UCLA library, and I found the book by Warren Bennis. So you asked me why I want to write books.
This your drastically transformed my life, Warren Bennis, On Becoming a Leader.
And I [00:40:13] tell all my students start here. Right? John Maxwell has some books too, and he's John Maxwell's kind of low-hanging fruit. It's not academic at all, but he talks about how you love the lid and some of that stuff. But this book On Becoming a Leader by Dr. Warren Bennis was the most pivotal because he talked about going back to what we were saying.
He talked about this idea It's it starts with you first, right? It starts with me first, right? If I can't take care of myself, if I can't leave myself, if I can't pay my registration tags and make sure that my car is registered, if I can't keep a relationship, if
I can't have a team that's growing. A small team of 15 people that I'm trying to get to a hundred, but then I'm in no,
place to be a leader. And so I was able to rework. I spent a whole summer diving in all these books about leadership and rework and it changed my mindset and my brain about how I approached it. And what I understand now is that leadership is so much more about other people and adding value to other people than it is about how do I, you know, how, how do I, push my own agenda?
And every single time I've tried to push my own. It never [00:41:13] works, but anytime I make it about the people and I could tell you story after story when I finally got this idea of empowerment, how do you lift up people? How do you help them become their fullest and highest potential and reach where they're supposed to reach in life?
It was amazing. This group that I was leading, this choir music program, we tripled in size in four months and I'd been with them two years and we just kept decreasing. Three months after reading these books tripled in size because I began to get what leadership was about. So I think at the core of it, it's really important that we take care of the people.
We've got to take care of ourselves first, though it starts here
and then it goes out. I don't know how I got off on that, but
that's how I originally found this idea of leadership development. And this is why I want to write, because that book was so impactful for me and how I approach people and how I approach the world that I'm hoping that my life will impact people in the same way going forward.
Rabiah (Host): I, yeah, and I, I read Synchronicity by Jaworski, I think, did you ever read that book?
JC Hurtado-Prater: I've heard that book before. I'm going to write that down. C
Rabiah (Host): synchronicity?
Yeah. And that one had a big impact on me, but [00:42:13] it was a little bit different than that, but basically the whole idea was servant leadership, right?
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes.
Rabiah (Host): That's the, thing. So when you look at the work you're doing, it's, you know, you've diversified yourself a little bit into different areas and one of them is teaching.
So two things; what has made, what made you want to go into that into teaching? And how does that kind of counterbalance with what, with the other stuff you're doing? Like meaning does it help you kind of balance otherwise or, or how's it working together?
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes. And okay. So let me just answer that first question about the counterbalance first and say yes. As a matter of fact, I'm lucky enough to be in a world where they actually say, if you're going to teach consult as well. It makes you a better teacher too. Because you're in the marketplace. You have one foot in the marketplace and you're helping add value.
And really what I get to do is go into in, in the companies and you're teaching, right? You're training these brilliant, bad-ass people .
And then I've got one foot over here with [00:43:13] students that are incredible and they're future leaders. So it it's really good. So that's there. And then the original question you asked, you
said what, what, what got me into teaching? Okay. This is a really good story. I was, I'll make it short. I was at RiversideCommunity College in, in Riverside is at the Norco campus. And at the time I was, I was going to finish up my degree and I was going to go to Cal State Northridge. And get my bachelor's degree in restaurant management, something like that, like business and just, I was going to work in restaurants my entire life.
And to this day, I'm passionate about restaurant work. That is a phenomenal industry. But then at the end of class, we had about 60 people in this class. Dr. Stephanie Curiox, she still teaches there. It was a history class, pulls me aside, out of everyone. I don't know why she did it, but she pulled me aside.
She said, what do you want to do with the rest of your. It was a weird question. I said, I'm just finishing this up and I'm gonna go to Cal State Northridge to get my degree. And then I'm going to go work in restaurants. She's a no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I see more for your life. You're you're going to go to UCLA and you're going to be a lawyer or a [00:44:13] professor.
And I still, like, I still get kind of emotional thinking about that because she, those words I'd never, I was a joker in school. I messed up mainly through high school. Got kicked out my senior year of high school. I'd get kicked out of other. That's why I landed in community college. I'd get kicked out of like two other colleges, one I couldn't afford to pay the other a failed out.
And then there was another community college. I fell out of that. And then they have this. This professor say, no, I see more for you. You're going to be a professor. I will tell you that probably impacted. But then honestly, growing up, I grew up in a family of educators. All of my heroes were educators. They all had doctorates.
And so I think even as a kid, I was adopted into this white family. And so I had all these. Educators. And it was, and they all had doctorates. And so I think even as a kid, I thought I want to get a doctorate, but I never had a path to Dr. Stephanie. Kiriakos said, here's what you're going to do. And it's pretty much been true what she said, that's a whole nother lesson, words matter.
Right. I tell people that all the time, words matter what we speak to other people, what, what we hear from other people, [00:45:13] it really matters to where we go, but I credit her. For me really believing, okay. Maybe I actually could teach. Cause I knew I wanted to, for many years, even as a kid, I wanted to be in business and teach, but I thought I could never do it.
Her words deeply impacted my life. And I think there, while I'm I'm on the path I am today, I'm grateful
Rabiah (Host): Well, and the fact that you were able to accept them because. It's hard sometimes to hear that kind of feedback that's positive when you haven't felt that way and to accept it and then to act with it.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Can I say something personal right now?
You know, this is, you know, this is interesting. You bring it up. That's so good, what you just said. This past Sunday. I got a call and today actually it's going on right now. I got call my high school best friend. I mean, we were just thick as thieves. He's I'm 42.
He's 42. Last Saturday, you overdosed with his wife and he's gone, right? And I've been processing that whole thing this week and like, how am I doing what I'm doing and going forward? And how is he on the very night [00:46:13] actually, one of the boards that I sit on last Saturday, I'm dancing, you know, the night away with all, all these people and the very same time
he's, he's overdosing and he's ending his life. And, and we both kind of came from the same area. We had the same opportunities. You know, both of us came from lower income and that's but I think, and I thought about this with my friend. He couldn't hear the words because everyone told him how much potentially had and how great he could be and where he could go in life.
That is so deep, Rabiah. That, it's one thing for someone to say it, but we have to be able to hear it. And I don't know why. Maybe, and I don't blame, you know, I'm not putting blame on him or say anything.
It's sad. He went through that, but I'm grateful that I was able to hear those words. Cause I
was on the same path that he was years ago, right?. I probably should be right where he is right now. But a professor turn it around, but not only did she say cause how many students does, she probably said that to him in her life. right. And how many others are maybe doing something different or it's not the same. So I'm grateful that there was something up there.
I don't know what it was. You're right. That was able to hear [00:47:13] those words and say, I'm going to internalize that because I was on a bus within two weeks and I think there was a group. I went to UCLA, stood on there and I thought, I'll never make it in. Like, they're the top public university in the world now. And I remember standing there, I'll never make it in, but I said, I'm going for it.
And so I said no to Cal State Northridge. Said, I'm just going to go for it. And I made it in, right? But her word. What she said, and I was able to hear it. That's deep. That's really, really deep. And I think speaking of leadership, we can say whatever we want to someone, but if they can't hear it and they can't receive it, it's not going to make a difference,
Rabiah (Host): right. Yeah. Yeah. And I spent years not hearing it or not being able to accept it.
JC Hurtado-Prater: same. Yes. I'm right there with you.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, and I am sorry about your friend too. I'm the same age as you. I lost my brother to an overdose like 10 years or 12 years ago. And I know exactly that feeling of almost, yeah, I'm still here.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Do you, is it, do you, because this is my second buddy I've lost in a [00:48:13] tragic way. The other one was killed in a murder suicide. Say, do you
ever have a sense of, and I don't mean to get personal, but do you ever have a sense of survivor's guilt?
Rabiah (Host): I have. Yeah.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yeah. Why am I still here? And that's your brother too? Mine
were just friends, but that's your brother.
Rabiah (Host): But it's still, I don't know. I try to with loss cause I've had different losses and, and I don't mind talking about it. I mean, it's just, it's part of my life and people can, you know, know about it, but it's just, I think a couple things. One is for me, I just find a way to honor that person.
And so I volunteer. One thing, one reason I'm in so much with nonprofit, I volunteered for shatterproof, which is an organization that works in the opioid and alcohol addiction
JC Hurtado-Prater: amazing. Wow.
Rabiah (Host): that's where I'm able to show my love to my brother and, you know, to help others. So they're not going through that. Cause I do think it's an important issue and yeah, I mean, I did, I spent, I spent a couple years, [00:49:13] I didn't write. I started comedy so late because I didn't want to give, I didn't want to let myself do those things that I would enjoy because how, how could I? And I think the sooner people can get out of that and realize that they are still here so the best thing they can do is continue to live and find a way to honor the, the loss of the person, the better it is. So, yes, I feel it. And yes, I think we walk that way.
JC Hurtado-Prater: yes. How many people need to hear that? Because I know people who've gone through and I never, I haven't lost anyone like a brother or sister like that. Right. I've lost close friends in those ways. But I know some people who've gone through some really tragic things and. It's it's hard for them to keep moving on.
You know, I mean, that's a really important thing that you're saying is that if I'm still here, I might as well make the most of it. But I know it's easy for me to say where I'm sitting than it is maybe for that person to hear it. Right. It sounds like you, how were you able to do that? What did, was there something that you internalized that, you know,
Rabiah (Host): therapy, honestly,
JC Hurtado-Prater: still, yes, [00:50:13]
Rabiah (Host): you know,
JC Hurtado-Prater: it, Robbie, I was going to say this and maybe I shouldn't say this on the podcast, you should never invite yourself. At some point, we need to come back and I want to talk about mental health therapy and leadership, right?
How that all meshes together. If like, like we should talk about that at some point because I think everything you just said, you're right. That's the game changing. That's the, and I tell people all the time, you know, they say only 11% of the population goes to therapy.
Rabiah (Host): That's actually remarkable because so many people talk about it in a way,
you
JC Hurtado-Prater: is. And that's what I thought too. But this was a, this was like a government study. I was reading it. It was like 11% or at least that's the numbers they have. It might be more than that, but it's 11%. But I've told people, even the church where I work at and I tell people all the time, you know, yes, you can have religion. You can find faith in God and all that stuff. But some of y'all just need to get some therapy, right? Like you need to get on a therapist's couch and you're gonna work that out. Right. Because It's like, obviously you've had religion for 20 years and it's done nothing. You're still jacked up. Get yourself [00:51:13] in with the therapist, right?
Rabiah (Host): Yeah.
JC Hurtado-Prater: changer. It's such a game changer.
Rabiah (Host): It's the, if you can't show compassion to yourself, it's going to be very hard for you to give it anywhere else.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Absolutely. Yeah. You can't show up to the world in the way that you want to. That's something I'm trying to figure it, right now. You talk about kind of where I'm going. I'm trying to figure out how to, because mental health is such a scary word for people, right? It's it's really so, and I was actually talking to my friend.
I think I sent you her name, Caitlyn Stone, that someone she's phenomenal. She's someone, but we're talking about trying to build conferences. Our first one, we're looking at February or spring of 2023. How do we mess this idea of leadership and mental health? But we can't say mental health. So we're trying to find like a buzzword for that.
But I really do believe that the entire world would elevate as more people begin to understand that this right here, what goes on between our heads, it affects more than what we understand, right? And I think therapy. It's like, we need to find another, like Facebook just changed their name to Meta. Right? We need to find another word [00:52:13] for therapy. I don't know
what it is. That's our job Rabiah. We're going to find
another word for therapy. Meta. I don't know.
Rabiah (Host): So Meta, know? Complaining about Facebook on Facebook. So Meta I don't know. I don't, can't with that, I can't with that it's so .Ridiculous.
JC Hurtado-Prater: How often do we see, you're so right. People complain.
Rabiah (Host): That's probably where he got.
JC Hurtado-Prater: That's brilliant.
Rabiah (Host): This it's ridiculous. But so one thing I want to talk to you about too is your podcast. So you're on my podcast, but I've listened to yours. Specifically, I listened to quite a few where you talked about character and people, anybody being able to change their character. So I guess I want you to talk a little bit about that because I found that really interesting, but also just if you want to talk about your podcast a little bit, so people know what, it's, what it's about.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Sure. And I would say I'm still building my podcast. I really want to cohost. And so I'm trying to, like, I love this right here, [00:53:13] this whole dialogue piece, and mine's pretty solo. Like you do interviews, right?
And I, I, so you have solo podcasts as well?
Rabiah (Host): I've done a few. Yeah.
JC Hurtado-Prater: few. Okay. I'm going to go because I've listened to some of yours as well, which are phenomenal and keep going, right? Like it's I love the title. Like that's so that's so deep. So, I'm still building mine. What I wanted to do is I said, I I've, I've been trying to do this for two or three years, and I finally, I just said, get the mic and just get started. And so this year it's all been about, do I have the consistency?
Cause you know, this is not easy. I mean, how many times did you have to chase me down? Right. Like to get me you're, I'm sure you're doing this all the time. Like you're chasing your guests down and trying to figure it out because you're interviewing, you know, busy people. So
I said, I need to get going and I want to do a hundred episodes on my own just to know that I can do it, know that I have the consistency to do that.
So that's what I'm doing next year though. And I'll, I think I'll reach a hundred by the end of this year. And I'm, I'm looking, I've got a co, a co a couple people I'm looking at. I really want to do a conversation [00:54:13] podcast where we talk about life and leadership and character and find books that we can talk about together.
But it comes down to us about this idea about character. And the reason why I'm talking about this kind of stuff is because again, it goes back to, I really think at the heart of every leader, it's who we are as a person. And if we, if we're jacked up on the inside, organization's going to be jacked up the team's going to be jacked up.
But you said something about character, you said you wanted to talk about.
Rabiah (Host): Just the idea that anyone can change their character. . Cause I think what I hear alot of people say, and I'll say I've said is, well, that's just their character. Not thinking that it's something that may besomeone could change. And sometimes I look at my character too, and think, well, that's just who I am now. And you talked about people could change.
JC Hurtado-Prater: there's some truth to that though. And I think this is what, and maybe this is why kind of broached it in and ended up episode. Most people, including myself think, okay, that's just a character trait. How many times did we say that? You know, all that. I'm not sure the details. [00:55:13] I'm not good at that. I'm not right.
We just, that's just who I am and what this book it's called the laws of human nature by Robert Green. And I'm just kind of walking. It's such a phenomenal book. But it talks about people can change their character. And I wish I actually have it's right here. It's right here. I'm getting ready to sign on, do my own podcast, but he does talk about people can change their character, but it takes an incredible amount of work and it starts with self-awareness.
It starts under, you know, with understanding who you are. And this is the problem with leadership. This is a problem with managers. Most people don't have that. Self-awareness right. They, they walk in a room and they have this view of who they are. And I will tell you one of the things that I have tried to practice in my own life and in my own leadership is this idea of radical truth, radical transparency, and Ray Dalio talks about this.
Where he has a culture that he's built with Bridgewater and associates, and they manage like $160 billion in assets, whatever they're huge. And he said that we grew that way because we have radical truth, radical transparency. So anyone at any time [00:56:13] can say whatever they want to say, they actually have meetings.
Robbie at where they have their iPads out. And as the person's talking, the people are giving them feedback right there. Everyone's got the iPad and I'm like, I could be talking to you and you could be typing right now. This makes no sense. You're getting lost in the woods and I'm watching this and I'm having to change up what I'm saying based on your instant feedback.
That's how they run it.
Rabiah (Host): Wow.
JC Hurtado-Prater: A lot of people leave, but we instituted that on one of the teams that I lead. And so I'll ask questions in front of the whole. What do I need to get better at? And these people answer, right? Like, like they tell me in front of everyone and I've learned over the last few years, I've lacked self-awareness.
I talk too much. I write. I think that first step is people have to be honest with themselves and they have to be, and they've got to allow people around them to be honest, right? This is, I think one of the key, this is going to be my Swan song and I'm going to change the name cause Ray Dahlia already got the radical truth, radical transparency.
I'm going to find another way to say it though, because this is what I think will drastically trend. Everything. Can we just be honest and authentic? [00:57:13] And then everyone in the room can hear what other people are thinking about them. Maybe it will help them transform. If leaders could hear, what do people really think about you,
right? Cause I think a lot of leaders have this mindset that they all love me. They're laughing at my jokes. When I walk in, Hey Boss. And , these people are just sucking up, man. They could hate you and be talking about you the next. So I think this idea of creating this culture, radical truth, radical transparency, that's how the character of a person changes.
And I think that. Character of a team can change in an organization as well, but it starts with being honest. That's probably a much longer answer than you were asking,
Rabiah (Host): no, that's fine. I mean, and I agree, cause I think I've been afraid of feedback sometimes, you
know, just because I am. Self-critical and self-aware, and people won't necessarily see me as bad, badly as I see myself, but they'll still see somethings, you know
it, so, yeah.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yeah, so character can change, but I think we've gotta be open and honest with ourselves and allow other people to be open and honest with us as.
Rabiah (Host): Totally. So we've talked a lot and you've [00:58:13] shared like really important advice and stuff, but is there any like advice or mantra that you want to share? Like maybe there's something that you just kind of like to impart?
JC Hurtado-Prater: Character, the only thing coming in my mind, characters, destiny. Again, I know that's not a high level leadership thing, but who we are on the inside is going to greatlyimpact our children, our families. And I've seen this negatively in my own life, right? This is why I'm doing so much work on my own self. It's and it will impact our teams, our bottom lines, creativity, innovation, the organizations. It's, there's too many studies out there that show but people don't really talk about this a lot, but character who we are as people, it impacts the work we do in the world and the people we lead in the world. And so I just think it's so important and this is why I love the term. And I heard it Monday. I'm not necessarily in the leadership development, I'm in a leader development, right? Like how do you help leaders develop into the fullest and highest potential?
And it starts right here at the center. That's the, that's probably the last thing I'd say.
Rabiah (Host): Nice. All right.
[00:59:13]
Rabiah (Host): So I have a set of questions called the Fun Five. They're meant
JC Hurtado-Prater: oh, let's go. Let's do it.
Rabiah (Host): Let's do it. So what's the oldest t-shirt you have and still wear?
JC Hurtado-Prater: Snap. Oh, I bet. It's like 12 years old. It came with me from the last place. and it's still here. Yeah. But I don't wear it unless I'm just around here.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. Yeah. I understand. I have some shirts that have no integrity as shirts anymore, you know, so I get it. All right. So it felt a bit like Groundhog's Day if you think of the Bill Murray movie.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes.
Rabiah (Host): What song would you have your alarm clock play every morning if it was Groundhog's Day?
JC Hurtado-Prater: If it were Groundhog's... Oh, my gosh. So many, you know what I'm listening to on repeat in my car? It's by J Boog. I think that's how you say his name. Let's do it again.
Nice to know. Yeah, let's do it again. I can't say all the words on here, but , [01:00:13] it's, it's a great, it's got like, it's, it's definitely hip hop, but it's got like this reggae feel to it as
well. And I took it with me to key west that's one. There's another song called tighter by fits in the tantrums.
And I have, have you heard of fits in.
Rabiah (Host): yeah.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Okay. This song is not very famous. It's not where they're made, but it's called tighter. It is unbelievable. It's a very sad song. It's depressing. It just, it's a great love song. Yeah.
it's great. Yeah.
So one of those two
Rabiah (Host): All right. Awesome. And coffee or tea or neither?
JC Hurtado-Prater: Neither. Straight water.
Rabiah (Host): Just water.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Water, a hundred percent of the time.
Rabiah (Host): You're the second person lately to say that. So that's
JC Hurtado-Prater: But you didn't make that an option.
Rabiah (Host): or tequila.
Okay. I mean, and you were probably smart enough to alternate them, so.
JC Hurtado-Prater: Yes.
Rabiah (Host): Cool. All right. Can you think of something that just kind of cracks you up when you think about it or makes you laugh or, or a time that youlaughed so hard you cried, either [01:01:13] one. I'd just like to hear what makes people laugh.
JC Hurtado-Prater: I laugh. And anyone I lead will tell you this. I say really funny things that I think are funny and I'm dying, laughing, and everyone's standing around me like this is the dumbest thing that's ever.
So I think I crack myself up quite a bit, but, like my, kids and everyone else is just like, Like, that's just the dumbest thing ever.
So there's many things I say that crack me up, but I couldn't be a standup comedian. Cause I'd be the person on stage. It's like dying laughing at my own jokes and everyone's standing there just watching me the whole time.
And I've actually done that. I actually had a stint doing comedy one time. It was the worst experience.
That's why I know what you do is so hard. It's not easy.
Rabiah (Host): well, my mom, when I said I was going to do comedy, she, she and I had talked about it for a while and she would say, well, you can't just do that though. You can't just laugh at your own jokes. And I'm like, I'll show you. You know?[01:02:13]
Can do what I want on stage. It's my, it's my five minutes. So. But she was kind of right. I mean, you have to hold it in. All right. Last one who inspires you right now?
JC Hurtado-Prater: Who inspires me right now? Oh my gosh. I have so many different inspiration. You know, I would say the one person over the last decade, he's a pastor. I worked for him. He's the guy I was telling you about. I learned from him that things don't build on their own. You've got to work and work and you know this, right?
You're trying to build this podcast. You have to put in the work. And I think I learned that from him. And, and when I think about, even as I make decisions, I think about what's the decision he might make, right? And I try to make decisions based on that. So I would say that he's been very inspirational in, in, in my life.
David Jeremiah is his name. He's been very inspirational for me.
Rabiah (Host): Cool. All right. Well and where should people go to find you? I have a bunch of stuff in the show notes, but
JC Hurtado-Prater: sure. Yeah. Google my name, Google me, Barbara, that library. [01:03:13]
Rabiah (Host): see this? Just as an example, you are
JC Hurtado-Prater: This is what I'm talking... That's what I'm talking about. think that's hilarious, but
Rabiah (Host): it's so, so illustrative.
JC Hurtado-Prater: all. So if they Google my name and the other day you asked me, what about websites? I'm actually getting to switch mine. I've got this company I'm trying to build called Cannonball and I'm working on the website right now.
So if they, if someone Googles my name, JC Hurtado-Prater, there's a lot of stuff that comes up. Schools I teach at and stuff. They'll find me there. And there's, I'm sure there's contact information. So yeah, find me there.
Rabiah (Host): All right.
JC Hurtado-Prater: And you can edit out anything you want to from this interview.
Rabiah (Host): it's fine. All right. Well, thanks so much, JC, it's been an absolute pleasure talking to you, so
JC Hurtado-Prater: It's been great talking to you too, and thank you. And Nicole speaks highly of you. If you. get to San Diego, please let us know and let's get together.
Rabiah (Host): Thanks for listening. You can learn more about the guest and what was talked about in the show notes. Joe Maffia created the music you're listening to. You can find him on Spotify at Joe M-A-F-F-I-A. [01:04:13] Rob Metke does all thedesign for which I am so grateful. You can find himonline by searching Rob M-E-T-K-E.
Please leave a review if you like the show and get in touch. If you have feedback or guest ideas, the pod is on all the social channels at, at more than work pod (@morethanworkpod) or at Rabiah Comedy (@rabiahcomedy) on TikTok. And the website is more than work pod dot com (morethanworkpod.com). While being kind to others, don't forget to be kind to yourself.
