S4E5 - Christina Giacona
This week’s More Than Work Podcast guest is Christina Giacona. We went to high school together in Santa Clarita, California and were in the band. After graduation, she pursued a degree in music from California State University, Northridge (CSUN). She has gone on to get her Masters at the University of New Mexico where she studied Native American Music, joined the Fort Smith Symphony in Arkansas part-time, as a clarinetist. She enjoys the opportunity to play with the innovative group.
Her and her partner Patrick Conlin, a violist and sound engineer, founded the Los Angeles New Music Ensemble in 2008 which they ran until 2014. Now they reside in Oklahoma where they have founded Onyx Lane, a full-service music production company. Christina is a professor at the University of Oklahoma teaching Native American Music and American Popular Music while studying for her second doctorate, this time in Cultural Anthropology.
“Cube of Light” is the latest album release from Christina and Patrick. They are taking it on tour soon for fully immersive audio and visual experiences giving the audience the opportunity to experience the album in a unique way.
Note from Rabiah (Host):
Christina outlines how her high school music dreams have been fulfilled and it made me think a lot about how these dreams would manifest in reality if we allow ourselves to take chances. I think that the advice she has for young people pursuing creative endeavours is unique and very practical since it comes from her lived experience. I’m on board completely with her “do it yourself” sentiment and hope people come away from this one encouraged to do just that.
High school reunion: Rabiah and Christina catchup about the fulfilment of dreams and Christina’s career in music and academia.
Transcript
Rabiah Coon (Host): [00:04:13] Hello, everyone. This week, I have another person from high school on the podcast. I went to school with some really cool people is what I'm finding out. A lot of people have done really awesome things. And this person, Christina Giacona and I were in band together. I think I ended up being more of a geek later in life than her.
We started out both band geeks together, but she is a professional musician, audio engineer, composer... I really like that she just has a lot of very tangible advice based on her lived experiences as an artist. She's also a college professor.
And I feel like the students who have her as an instructor are really fortunate because they have someone who's just practical, who knows what they've been through and who's gonna try to help them succeed. And I can almost imagine it'd be really awesome to be in her class at this point. So we talk a lot about [00:05:13] her career and how she's gotten to where she she is, but also just about things she'd like to see in the future and the music industry.
And I think it's really interesting because it's something that all of us listen to all of us like to listen to music or most people do. I don't know anyone who doesn't like any music at all. I did listen to her album. I'm going to have all the links to everything she talks about in the show notes. And I just hope that you get out of this one, that, if you're a creative person, especially, but anything else you do it yourself. I think that was the big advice for me that I got from it.
It's just, if you want to do a thing, do it yourself. And I think other people have talked about this and this is almost a theme I'm seeing with a certain type of guest. I have that. They just go and try something. And kind of, I don't know if they do it fearlessly, they might actually have a lot of trepidation doing it, but it appears to be fearless. They just go and try the thing. So. I hope you enjoy this interview with Christina Giacona. Thanks so much for listening. And of course, don't forget to like subscribe, [00:06:13] follow, any of that, that you can do. Write a nice review for me. I would really appreciate it. And let me know if you have any thoughts on the episode, I've gotten some feedback lately. People have, let me know how things go. It actually helps keep me going. And it also is great because I can tell the guests.
What people liked about their messaging as well. So it's really nice to hear from people more than work pod at gmail dot com (morethanworkpod@gmail.com). And thanks everyone. Enjoy the. the show
Welcome to "More Than Work", the podcast reminding you that your self worth is defined by more than your job title. I'm Rabiah, an IT Project Manager, Comedian, nonprofit volunteer, And sometimes activist. Every week, I'll chat with a guest about pursuing passions outside of work or creating meaningful opportunities inside the workplace.
As you listen, I hope you'll be inspired to do the same. Here we go...[00:07:13]
welcome back everyone. And today I have another person from high school, but this time it's actually someone who was in my sister's class. My sister and I are two months apart so wasn't that big of an age difference, but it was enough where she was more in my sister's circle than mine. And I'm really excited to be talking to her today.
Christina Giacona, music producer. How are you doing?
Christina Giacona: I'm doing great. Thanks for having me on.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah, thanks for being here. This is really, it's already fun. It's already fun. Just seeing your face
Christina Giacona: Ah,
Rabiah Coon (Host): and no one else can because it's a podcast, so too bad.
Christina Giacona: Next time video cast.
Rabiah Coon (Host): exactly. So, Yeah. Why don't you just introduce yourself, where we're talking to you from.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. I am located in Oklahoma City. I'm a music producer. I am a college professor at the University of Oklahoma. I've been getting into producing classical music for film and for CDs and records and things like that. And I started my own business called "Onyx Lane", which while it's based in Oklahoma [00:08:13] City actually has roots in Castaic, California.
It was the street I grew up on.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Nice.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. So I'm here to answer questions that come up about music and life, I guess.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Maybe, maybe Castaic. So, so, so people know Castaic is a suburb north of Los Angeles, and you might've heard of Santa Clarita because of the "Santa Clarita Diet" and things like that. And we were a little bit north of there too. More of a truck stop kind of town you could say.
Christina Giacona: Yeah, I haven't been back in awhile, but I feel like it looks the same.
Rabiah Coon (Host): I think it looks pretty much the same. They added a Ralphs and Starbucks, and then I think one of those went away. So
Christina Giacona: Oh, boo.
Rabiah Coon (Host): But yeah, I'm pretty sure it's about the same too. It's been a while. Yeah. So we were in high school band together. Now my path took me to owning several guitars over the last 25, 30 years and not learning how to play any of them.
And your path took you into doing music. How did you just kind [00:09:13] of, did you decide right after school that you were going to keep going with music or what was, what was that path.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. You know, as everybody in high school you have ideas and hopes and dreams that are realistic. And then some that you need to somehow find a way to put that into some kind of paying entity. But I knew I wanted to do music. I didn't know specifically what. I played clarinet in high school band and I did the youth orchestra at the community college and I knew I could do a music degree going in and I actually only applied to one college,
with only one degree option that was Cal State Northridge which I ended up going to. They had an early acceptance. Like they let you know like early on, if you got accepted to the program and I got accepted so then I just stopped applying.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. well, that's smart. There was a fee. Every time we applied. So.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. And it wasn't like looking back. I'm like, why did I do that? But, you know, I mean, it was what it was. So I actually started with a [00:10:13] music industry degree path and I think it was my first semester. They said, you know, if you switched to clarinet, perform. You could get a full ride scholarship.
And I was like that one, that's the one. And so I, I took the same classes with a focus in clarinet. And then I wanna say my junior year, I decided that I knew I wanted to teach music, but probably at the collegiate level. And so to do so I would need at least a master's possibly a doctorate. So I got a doctorate in clarinet performance. And then I also am almost a PhD in Cultural Anthropology as well. So who knows where that came from? No.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah, well with anthropology, as you can find out, right? Like,
Christina Giacona: Yes, yes, no. It was more at I, like I said, I teach at the University of Oklahoma. You get to take two free classes every semester. And so I was teaching Native American music and I wanted to learn more about anthropology. I have to declare a major after 12 hours. So that was that. And then [00:11:13] yes, now I'm supposed to be writing a dissertation, but you know, talking on a podcast instead.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. Well, it seems like a good, seems like a good use of time.
Christina Giacona: Yes.
Rabiah Coon (Host): With clarinet performance and with going all the way to the doctorate level in that, what does that entail? I mean, I've not met anyone who has a doctorate in actually the performance of an instrument.
Christina Giacona: so it has to do with a lot of clarinet play. No.
Honestly, what you're trying when you take these degrees that are focused in like one specific instrument, you are trying to become a professional quality player, but also a pedagog. And so, the doctoral program is about specifically honing your skills as a clarinet player, but then how to teach those skills.
And so I am the second clarinetist in the Fort Smith Symphony in Arkansas. So I, once a month, I actually drive out there and uh, play. I had a clarinet studio for a long time. But when we started doing more [00:12:13] audio recording and production it just there wasn't time. So, all the clarinetists in the world please continue teaching your programs and your studios.
Cause it's a really, it's a really important thing.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. That's really cool. And did you have to, when you got out of school yet to go audition basically to different orchestras.
Christina Giacona: Yeah, I so there's kind of two paths. Once you have a doctorate or you don't have to have a doctorate it's to be at a professional orchestra, that's hopefully full time, or you're going to do some aspect of teaching. So I auditioned for the Fort Smith symphony and it was part-time, which was perfect for me. And I took a few full-time auditions.
But I knew I to the core, like my core is I'm an academic and a teacher and a performer. So I needed to find some way to do all those. But it's not uncommon for people who are playing and like the LA Phil, they also teach at like the, the colleges surrounding us.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. And so what, what are you teaching right now? What's the kind of curriculum?
Christina Giacona: So, I'm teaching [00:13:13] mostly music and culture classes. So I'm teaching native American music. I often teach world music and American popular music and I'm also teaching a capstone class for the school of music. See mostly seniors super seniors as well. Essentially the class is a capstone is supposed to be encompassing everything that you've learned throughout the last four or five years.
But our shift is, well, you have this degree in music now, what? So what are career path? Job opportunities things in the future that don't necessarily involve just playing your instrument or just teaching? So that's the class I'm, I'm, I'm teaching this semester. It's really fun. We have a lot of guests come in and talk about their journey and what they do and the industry now
Rabiah Coon (Host): that's cool. I'm in a program right now
where we're going to have a capstone at the end, and I actually didn't know what it entailed. So this gives me a better idea that.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. So for for our students specifically the first half of the semester is [00:14:13] how do you apply for jobs, preparing all your academic and professional materials, and then what are career opportunities that you could essentially try and get into after graduation?
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah.
Christina Giacona: they do a little project, you know, based, based off of what they want to do in the future.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. Are these undergrad.
students or graduate students? Oh, cool. That's that's really good because I think just like, I mean, for people who get out of high school and maybe aren't going to go to college, there's not really a good path necessarily. And then when you get out of college, it's the same thing.
I mean, there's this assumption that you got a college degree now you're going to have a job right away. But especially in the arts, that's really difficult. But even outside of that, there's just. It's almost an ethics issue at this point. Like people are investing so much money and going into massive debt, getting an education and then don't have any guidance after that.
So...
Christina Giacona: Oh, yeah. Yes.
Rabiah Coon (Host): That's cool you're doing that. And as far as the popular music course, what's a [00:15:13] typical lesson?
Christina Giacona: So we essentially start with big band jazz and then I just kind of go through the music industry and discuss different time periods and the music that was the. So, I mean, I like the sixties, so I kind of spend a lot of time. I'm surprised my students don't know who the Beatles are.
Rabiah Coon (Host): They really
Christina Giacona: They really don't.
Rabiah Coon (Host): my God.
Christina Giacona: And so I was like, so I had a recording session about a month and a half ago. And it was for a track for Julian Lennon. And so I want him to come and tell my students like, oh my gosh, I just recorded this track for Julian Lennon. And I was like, John Lennon's son.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Oh, no, I that's so weird. You know, just because, well, I guess, cause our parents are all of the age where they were into the Beatles or, or they at least admitted had made a decision, they were a Stones person or Beatles person, but the Beatles were still part of some kind of discussion.
Right.
Christina Giacona: So
Rabiah Coon (Host): how, oh man, [00:16:13] it's so crazy.
It's so crazy. wild. And then for the Native American music, how did you get into that?
Christina Giacona: You know, I was offered a teaching job and that was one of the classes that needed to be filled. And so it was like, yes, of course. Totally. That was 13 years ago. And I actually didn't realize how much I knew about the subject matter. So I got my master's degree at the university of New Mexico, and I focused a lot of my extracurricular research topics on native American music.
And then when I, I went to the university of Oklahoma where I now teach a lot of the options were native. Culture specific. And so it was this actually, it was a really natural fit. It was unexpected career path change, but I love it. I love it. And then so my cultural anthropology PhD is actually focused on native American music and culture and linguistics.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Oh, wow. Well, and so a couple of things around this subject, just not knowing much about it, but also thinking this is [00:17:13] something that. I'd like to talk about. Cause I'd like people to then become more aware to w what's been the biggest influence on basically other music I'll say or popular music or anything from native Americans.
I mean, I can imagine like there's a percussive element for sure. But what, what is the biggest influence that you teach?
Christina Giacona: Yeah, so, Western music often is accompanied by some chordal instruments., a piano guitar, old school lute. And Native American music is focused around progressive instruments , that could be drums, it could be rattles. It could be dance regalia. But one fun fact there's actually a documentary called Rumble.
And it's essentially Native American musicians to help build the rock and roll industry. And so the song is the title is based off of a song named Rumble. And it's actually just talked about all of these native American musicians like Jimi Hendrix who had influential success. They were [00:18:13] influential and they had success in the industry and we don't necessarily talk about their
upbringing or backgrounds. So that's always a fun thing to talk about in the class and the influence of music. Also there, there's kind of like an explosion of indigenous media and television shows and movies all coming out right now. And so it's actually nice to start to see emerging composers who are Native as well.
So, while I don't teach about them this semester, it's definitely something I'm gonna. Next semester, once more, more of these options are available for streaming.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. So Jimi Hendrix was Native American? I had no idea.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. And the song Rumble, the artist is Link Wray so if you're into fifties and sixties, music, you'll probably knowLink Wray.
Rabiah Coon (Host): I don't offhand, but I maybe it's just my youthfulness that's
Christina Giacona: He wasn't super popular unless you were like, you know, like that was your thing. That was your
Rabiah Coon (Host): in it. Yeah.
No, but that's a good shout. So definitely we'll check that out. And that's just, [00:19:13] that's interesting. And then as far as linguistics, I mean, one thing I think the U S. famous for is taking all that away from people and wanting them to not have their culture and especially Native Americans as well, so, on the subject of linguistics, what kind of things are you talking about?
Christina Giacona: So, what I started focusing on when I was writing my masters document was looking at how american popular music, actually stereotypes Native American music by essentially creating situations where they use like faux or fake Native American music. And so I was kind of looking at the words that people would say.
And then while they're trying to be positive in nature, usually had some kind of negative aspect to it. So, that's what I was focusing on lyrically and musically. I'm also looking at how a sound can represent something. So, you know, when you go "wah, wah", you're not saying anything, but everyone goes like, "Oh, okay, that was bad." Or, you know, "That was a [00:20:13] fail." So things like musically, how does it mean something to us if we were to put words to it?
Rabiah Coon (Host): Huh. So what's an example of maybe a word or something that was used in a song that might have been offensive to...?
Christina Giacona: Yeah, I saw old labeling essentially in, in were, in songs like in the fifties and sixties, they would just label indigenous people using terms that luckily now, today we look at them as being derogatory. Sometimes it would more be like the concept of something. So there were, I don't even know a ridiculous amount of songs that discuss like the concept of an "Indian giver". So the idea that somebody would give something and take it away. So a lot of people argue that it's just the concept and I was like, well, sure. But we're actually displaying that concept as representative of a culture by specifically calling it an Indian giver. It in the songs,
they actually will have a narrative around somebody who's indigenous taking something away. [00:21:13]
Rabiah Coon (Host): Hmm.
Christina Giacona: So there it's like very subtle things that you don't really think about because the songs are usually catchy, but then I was like, that's offensive. What, how drawing those conclusions to those things that are inaccurate is offensive.
Rabiah Coon (Host): yeah. Oh, that's interesting. Cool. So other than being a professor and doing the orchestra part-time you referred to Onyx Lane. That's your production company, and that's with your partner,
Christina Giacona: Patrick Conlin. Yes,
Rabiah Coon (Host): is he your partner partner or your ?
okay.
Christina Giacona: Both he's partner in crime and partner in relationship.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Okay, good. So, well, that's, that's cool.
How did you guys decide to set that up and decide that was your path?
Christina Giacona: Yeah. So we actually met each other when we're both in school as students at the University of Oklahoma. He's a violinist, he's an audio engineer, he's a composer. And we [00:22:13] actually formed the Los Angeles, new music ensemble beforehand, the Los Angeles, new music ensemble in 2008. And so we ran that it was a classical ensemble that focused on contemporary new music.
And so we did that for six years. I'll release an album. We played numerous concerts, commissioned works. We recorded an album and we were kind of beholden to the audio engineer so we could express changes and things we wanted. And sometimes they were unable to fulfill the changes we wanted or they just didn't hear the nuances that we were listening for.
So we're like, well, what if we just did it?
Save a lot of money. I'm running out of studio space and engineer fees. And we both dabbled in recording. So, I got a job at the University of Oklahoma. He actually got a job as the assistant director at the University of C entral Oklahoma, and they have a campus [00:23:13] that's called it's called ACM at UCO.
So the Academy of Contemporary Music at the University of Central Oklahoma. He teaches audio production there. And so, our company is relatively new. It's about five years old. But we've been recording together and making albums for a really long time. We just essentially made it official. It looks, you know, legit business.
And we also wanted to start separating out some of the funds so if it was our academic paychecks versus when we were doing freelance, we wanted different business entities for those. So our main gig is recording classical music in either a form where it's like a live recording or for film.
And so we essentially divide and conquer. So Patrick will be like the engineer, I'll produce. I will conduct we both play in the sessions. We have a wonderful teammate. His name is Josh, Josh Bivins and he does the video aspect. And then we do the audio aspect. So, we are busier than we've ever been. It's [00:24:13] like the pandemic was difficult where it took away all of the live performance opportunities, but then all of these recording opportunities essentially replaced them.
Rabiah Coon (Host): And are you recording for people outside of Oklahoma and in Oklahoma?
Christina Giacona: Yeah. We obviously we're, our focus is Oklahoma City, but yeah, we're in LA a lot recording. New York. Patrick is Canadian. And so, the borders have just opened up so we're actually probably going to be recording an Ottawa out here next month. The Oklahoma legislator just actually passed a bill for a rebate for film production and post-production.
And so there is a company we're starting to work with there Prairie surf media. So we're, we're going to be collaborating with that, to do the audio. And then they're doing you know, the, the sound stages. The production, what we would, we're going to end up starting to do the post.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Nice. Yeah.
that's great. And well, and there's different cities like will end up losing contracts and [00:25:13] stuff, and then other ones can get them so.
Christina Giacona: Yes. I think, I think it's a 12 year bill and it's, it's, we're seeing a lot of influx in jobs and people coming from out of state you know, to, to work on the projects here.
Rabiah Coon (Host): yeah, I can see that. Because you were focused on performance for a while, but now the performance is in a different way, not necessarily as in front of an audience, is there something that you find that's fulfilling about doing the recording versus the live performance. And how does that differ for you as an artist?
Christina Giacona: Yeah, there are things that you can do in front of a live audience and the reaction you get from that live audience that can never be replaced with recording. You know, like the reaction that the audience has because they see something live? You feed off of that. I'm sure you feed off of that to, you know, doing standup and things like that when people, you know, so that can't be taken away.
What is amazing about recording is you can fix mistakes that you can't [00:26:13] fixwhen it's live.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah, that's really true.
Christina Giacona: So the problem with recording the w I say, it's the problem. It's the thing that's great about it and is also the problem is that you can fix and record and rerecord. At some point you still have to deem that it's okay, that there's probably going to be some kind of mistake. Unless somebody is like a machine or
not a person there's going to be inflections in playing, there's going to be a little bloops and blips, and that makes it human sounding versus computer generated, which is, we all, we all enjoy the natural, right?
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah, yeah. This sounds better. I mean, in general, I think,
Christina Giacona: I
Rabiah Coon (Host): don't
Christina Giacona: know.
I agree. I agree. And so, sometimes when you know, you're in the studio, it's like this, I don't know, you're you just get so sucked up into the perfection aspect of it, you lose the human aspect of it. So it's like, it's [00:27:13] okay if there's a mistake. Did it sound good? Did it add to, I don't know, interest and performance?
But I mean, you could make things that are really, really good after the fact, whereas you only have so much control over when it's live.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah, sure. I mean, even when editing the podcast, sometimes I'll overdo it and then I'll just reverse what I did cause it just doesn't sound like the person, how they were talking anymore. It sounds like some perfect version of that. And I had someone commented to me. "Oh, you say "like" so much, you you're definitely Californian."
And then, so I've become very self-conscious of that in the last few months. But then on the other hand, maybe it's just how I talk and it's a filler word and that's, I don't know. That's okay, you know?
Christina Giacona: Well, I have people say the same exact thing about me. I say "like", and I say, "oh". So I'm like, "like, oh", Isn't it just the way we process? Because our brains are going so fast [00:28:13] and then it takes us a second to say what we want to say.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. And we can try not to do it by pausing a lot, which I have to do right now if I want to do that. And I do notice I say the word so a lot, right before starting a new thought. So there's some things you fix, but I think, and you can, when you're done recording. But some things just kind of will sound good and. If for you, like Yeah, It's. a little area, more organic and stuff sounding, it's a little bit better at some point. Right.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. Yeah. It's. I think we sound California cause that's where we grew up. But I feel like when I'm in the classroom and I'm teaching my students feel like I'm more relatable.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah.
Christina Giacona: I'm not always using academic speak. I mean, I can, and I have to. With conferences, I code switch all the time. naturally, yeah. So everybody listen to this, like, you know, this is just natural speak.
Rabiah Coon (Host): This is how we talk. I agree. No, it's [00:29:13] even funny at work. I mean, I can be really formal and my mom has commented that when I'm really angry, I get mean because I just elevate my vocabulary so that I become difficult to understand. And that's accurate, you know, it's a power play. Like, oh, all right, well, I'm just gonna now be pretentious, right, as a, as a way to get back at people. But I think there's something about just natural sound, whether it's how people talk or how, how they play or anything like that. So I think that's pretty cool. Do you find though that you're, you are critical of your own performance and are you kind of a perfectionist, even if you tell other people like, "Hey, it's okay"
or something, how's that? How do you handle yourself?
Christina Giacona: Yeah, I'm very much perfectionist. Let's see to a fault. But yeah. So with any art form, when you are going through editing process, you have to push yourself to be the best [00:30:13] version that you can be. So the best performance you can play and. It is just something that I think being a perfectionist, I demand that perfection and other people, but I'm also realistic.
You could demand perfection, but then there comes a point where, you know, it's only going to get as good as it's going to get. And that's, that's the point where I think good producers can push people to that line. And then. Try not like, you know, if you try and go pass it, you're actually going to essentially do the opposite.
People are usually ended up playing worse. So, what I see in myself as a producer is I'm very knowledgeable on good performance, a good performance should be, and then I'm really knowledgeable on the production aspect of it. And combining those two things. I, I think this makes me a really good producer and.
I think the next couple of albums, we actually have three albums coming out
Rabiah Coon (Host): Oh, wow.
Christina Giacona: produced and recorded in November. And yeah, I think they're really good representations of unexplained and [00:31:13] me as a producer and Patrick, as an engineer, I'm playing on some of them, some of them are just producing.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Nice. As far as albums then w how do you decide when to make an album and like on a theme and how does that process work? I know for talking to different writers, including even knowing my own self, and when I decide to write something I know there's a certain process for me.
What's your process to say, Oh, this is something I'm just gonna enjoy playing in my living room or whatever, versus this is something I want to do a full production with.
Christina Giacona: Oh, that's a good question. Let's see. So for music, for different genres, they have different focal points of what should be an album. So for classical music, it's usually there's a composer that you want to record, and then you kind of craft an album around that for other popular genres of music.
It's, it's more songs that you've written or maybe a concept or like a conceptual album that put together. [00:32:13] For me the music I write it can be played live, but it includes so many synthesized and manipulated sounds that the best version of it will be recorded. And so the last album that Patrick and I just released, it's called "Cube of "Light", it is a combination of recording orchestral instruments with synthesizers and then manipulating that sound. And so we're actually in the process of actually doing an Atmos mix of it. So it's like the surround sound plus the speakers. So like an immersive audio version of it. So I guess it's like, you know when we go to like big live performances, they actually include all of those immersive elements in the performance, but whereas like an album is just like you at home.
So I always feel like my, my recording projects are project that you listened to in a space that elevates the music.
Rabiah Coon (Host): So like with "Cube of Light" for example, [00:33:13] you would suggest someone listened to it maybe more open in a room versus in headphones.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. And I guess headphones are also, some typos are also capable of doing the immersive audio mixed now.
So once that is up I think that's the optimal way to listen to it. So the album actually came out of- it was born through an art installation project that we did. So the first version of it was different music videos.
We had contemporary dance videos that we made, so people would go into the space and they would watch these videos in a dark space, and lay down on a yoga mat and be surrounded by sound like it was a blanket of sound. So we are actually working on doing a live version of this that will include the immersive audio mix with live instruments.
Rabiah Coon (Host): That you'll perform in Oklahoma.
Christina Giacona: So we're going to take it on tour. So it's first it's first version is actually going to be performed here in October down in Lawton, Oklahoma. I have, [00:34:13] I'm a composer in residence for a new music festival they have down there this year. And then there is a new arts museum in Oklahoma City called Oklahoma Contemporary, and they have a beautiful performance space.
So, we're going to have everybody laying down, listening to the music. And then we are actually going to include visual light sculptures that go along with the music.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Okay. That's cool. And did you envision those kind of, when is that something you do when you're performing music or writing music. Do you have, like, do you envision certain things in your mind? I mean, some people, even when they hear music, they see color, for example, that's an actual thing. Right?
But do you have anything like that where you actually see things or did it just come together for you guys in this case?
Christina Giacona: I see things. I picture things. So some people might view this as a learning disability. I actually think it's the exact opposite. So, I'm dyslexic. And so when I see [00:35:13] things, I actually see different versions of things and say, Patrick does. And he thinks it's so creative. He's like, I never would have imagined that.
And I would say, well, that's what I saw. And then it's, for me, it's just the flipping of some letters. It's like a D and a, B might look the same, especially if I'm not wearing my glasses. But artistically, the same thing happens where I reverse and I put things in retrograde or I flip them upside down and then it creates this different conceptual thing
than when we started. So ideas are ideas, right? So you have an idea. And what comes out of that idea can be sometimes limited by functionality and the ability to actually implement it. And so through seeing things sometimes like the opposite ways we can, I can conceptualize things that others don't and then obviously, then you have to learn how to implement it, but that's a whole different thing.
Rabiah Coon (Host): huh? That's that's really cool.[00:36:13] It just creates like, just a completely different way of looking at it in general. Hm. Yeah.
So if you guys, have you been on tour before as an artist?
Christina Giacona: Not as like Christina and Patrick, but yes. I played in a touring orchestra thattoured throughout North America. I've been in smaller bands where I've toured, but this is the first time where it's justour music that we're going to take to different places. So the goal is we are, we are both academics.
We are both teachers, we're both performers and producers. And so I think our focus is going to be an at like university campuses and actually work with students and how to create projects similar to what we do.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Huh? So is there something with teaching that, do you look back and think, I wish some teachers I had would have done this, or do you have anything that maybe someone did that you try to apply even now? Because we are really impacted, I think by our experiences [00:37:13] as kids in school.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. That's a good question. I've had a lot of teachers and they've all been influential in some way. In college. It was actually very interesting. So I wasn't necessarily encouraged to do things outside of my major. So as a clarinet performance major, they really wanted, everybody wanted me to focus solely on clarinet; clarinet playing, clarinet performance, clarinet teaching.
And I was always interested in other art forms and other genres. And I had two, two clarinet professors. So Mr. Lemons, Keith lemons at the University of New Mexico saw that I was interested in other things. And while he was still trying to focus me only on clarinet as a good professor would he allowed me to explore other areas of music.
And then my doctoral clarinet professor, his name's David Etheridge. And he was also very encouraging of doing things that include music, but aren't just clarinet [00:38:13] playing focused. So that was, that was, I think, sh I think that's why I kind of started to explore the realm of music production to some extent. I have never studied music production formally.
It's all self-taught to some extent. But I say that when you're in college, you just because you don't take a specific class on something doesn't mean you're not learning it in your class.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Right. Yeah.
Christina Giacona: So, I don't think I'm necessarily self-taught in that aspect. I think I absorbed it by being around being part of projects, working with people.
Rabiah Coon (Host): But I think that's a good point though because just thinking about even what I'm doing right now at work, I've just switched to marketing and so I've this week, like learned or in the last week learned to animate a logo using After Effects and, you know, have had to play with all this stuff with video that I hadn't done before.
And then looking at a lot of my friend, Rob, who's a graphic designer looking at how he basically taught [00:39:13] himself, but absorbed things at work. And then other friends at work like who are developers that they're constantly doing that, right? They don't learn... If you go to college and you're studying software development or engineering, you're not going to learn everything that you need for the project X that you're doing now, right? And so it's important for people to know though that the things are absorbing and learning that if they know how to apply them eventually, then they can go in any direction. So for you, for example, you could have just stayed on a full-time performance track, probably just from what you've done, but you've also chosen
to pursue the other things you're passionate about, right?
Christina Giacona: Correct. And for me, and this is not for everyone, so for performance, you are always playing somebody else's music, usually in an orchestra, you don't, you're not even choosing what what pieces you're playing. The concert is this. Here is your part. You're supposed to play at a specific way.
And for me, I get bored doing [00:40:13] that, you know, or I recompose what somebody has written. And so it's perfect being in a part-time orchestra is amazing. And they're doing such interesting programming at Fort Smith that it gives me the ability to play clarinet, which is truly my passion. And then I have the ability to create my own music, also playing clarinet, singing, playing guitar, and another various instruments.
And so I'm completely fulfilling my dreams, that those, those dreams I had in high school, where I was like, I knew I wanted to do music, but I don't specifically know what
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. Yeah. Well, the typical dream is like, oh yeah, I want to be on stage in a band and that's it. right.
But then there's all these other ways to incorporate music. I think that's what interests. A lot about people when they're doing creative things, is that there are different ways to incorporate it. It's not just that one path that you saw.
So I liked that even with your students, with the capstone program, that that's what you guys are doing, because I feel like even like parents listening, [00:41:13] maybe they'll hear their kids say, oh, I want to be a YouTuber, which has gotta be so frustrating as a parent now. Or I want to do like TikTok videos, but then it's like, Maybe those aren't viable career options necessarily, but they can hear that the kid likes video production, the kid likes performance, the kid likes posting things and like doing social media and those are all viable ways. So I don't know. I just feel like this, I can kind of tie those two together and this conversation.
Christina Giacona: Absolutely. No, that is exactly right. And as you said, you know, you always want to be in a band and play on stage, but they actually never teach you that that's a business like a band is a business. And so in Oklahoma City here, I have had the opportunity to work a lot with Scott Booker, which is the, who is the manager of The Flaming Lips who are based in
Oklahoma city. And he's can use the, I think he's his official title is Executive Director of the Academy of Contemporary Music at UCO. And so Patrick and him work together daily and [00:42:13] what the students are being taught when they go to that program is okay. You have music talent. You have the drive to be in a band. How do you run it as a business?
And then even if you don't go into music specifically, the skills you're learning at that school are business related, which can be applied to what, everything? Choose an industry. There you go.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. yeah. There's business. I mean, it's all business basically, you
Christina Giacona: A university is a business. It's just a giant business.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. It is. It really is. Well, yeah, especially in the states,
Christina Giacona: yeah.
Rabiah Coon (Host): are. They make a lot of money. So do you have anything else, musically that you've been thinking that you want to aspire to? I mean, you're already doing quite a bit, but is there something that you're like, oh, I saw that now that sounds interesting.
Christina Giacona: I don't know if there's something new or a new avenue, but the sad fact is in the world of music production , there are only of all the producers, only 2% of them are female.[00:43:13]
Which is a scary statistic. And my goal as a musician, as a producer, and as a teacher is to try and change that, and encourage women to go into the STEM fields. Try and encourage that women should try and seek out production jobs, whereas often they're discouraged to do so. And then like, even when they're learning how to record, embracing those opportunities and you know what? Taking advantage of them, maybe, maybe you take lead on something. You don't always have to be second, that kind of thing. So, that's something I am hoping can change.
I did do a workshop. Oh, I don't know, six months ago, I kind of lost track of time. Has it
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. yeah. Basically for sure.
Christina Giacona: Where it was this, it was a, it was a training session for producing and I was encouraged to see so many females sign up for it. So hopefully that will change [00:44:13] in the future.
Rabiah Coon (Host): That's great. I mean, that's, that's staggering, that's statistic 2%, you know? That's bizarre. I mean, cause you, you know that more people are interested in music, but if you don't see anyone like you doing it or doing that aspect of it then it's gonna be hard to, hard to know that you can pursue it.
So is there anything else that you want to cover?
Christina Giacona: If you're listening to this and you are a young budding producer, or you're just an art person in general, one of the best things for me, actually, this sounds weird was moving away from Los Angeles. And why I say this is Oklahoma City is a new market.
It is expanding its horizon. It's actually allowing people who don't have that much experience to take leadership roles in the arts and music industry and film industry and just creative jobs in general. So, [00:45:13] because I left now, LA based companies are drawing me back. And so if you move to a giant place, a very busy place, like a New York or London or Los Angeles, and you're not finding the work there,
I would not think that you're not gonna make it. I think you just need to find job, smaller job markets, where you can build your skills and then you can move to those larger markets. Austin is a great example of that. It was the small town that believed in music, and now it's a music, a giant music cup, right.
So, Oklahoma city has done that for me. It is, it's still growing. It's still trying to find exactly what it is. But a lot of bands, like the platelets have had a lot of success starting here. And then essentially, you know, when you're in a band you could live anywhere, then you could cause you're on, you know, you just go on tour.
So then I think some, some other band lives in like Seattle, maybe somebody else lives abroad. [00:46:13] Yeah.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. well, I know Brandi Carlisle, like they live in some compound in Oregon or something like that because she did concerts during the pandemic and was just out there with her band and her family. It's pretty cool. No, that's a good shout. That's really good. Cause one of my next question would have been about advice.
So that was. 'cause that that is great advice. And also just the idea not to just give up because something didn't work out how you thought
Christina Giacona: definitely.
Rabiah Coon (Host): in the first place.
Christina Giacona: If you want to go on the advice train. Okay. Let me tell you, teachers have all of the advice. They don't necessarily always do it. So this was gifted to me. And of course at the time I was kinda like, you know, what? So there is this thing where you go to graduate and then you fear the future, all creatives do this, right?
So it's, it's like, do you just take a job for the sake of taking a job or do you just try and use your skills that you learned in school [00:47:13] and, you know, to have a creative, creative job path? And so of course you need to pay the bills. Unfortunately in the United States, you have to find a job that has health care, you're paying for it out of pocket.
And so that kind of does limit, you know, freelancers and the work they can take on. But what I was told and what I do is don't wait for somebody to give you an opportunity. You have to create the opportunity for yourself. So, if you want to record an album, record an album, don't wait for some label to go like here, record an album.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah,
Christina Giacona: So if, if you want, if you want to make a music video, Yeah. What are your friends? You know, probably posted pretty good videos online, you know, collaborate together. And so the other thing that's really important with always creating opportunities for yourself is that then you're never not working, right.
They might not necessarily be paid gigs, but it shows that you're continually working in the field and then people will see [00:48:13] your work and then they want to hire you.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. Yeah, because then you have something to show
Christina Giacona: exactly.
Rabiah Coon (Host): right? Yeah.
Cause if you I've, I've talked to people before where they say, Oh I like doing X, Y, or Z. And then it's like, do you have a portfolio? And it's really just means, do you have somewhere online people can see what you're doing, whether it's your Facebook account or like, if you're a designer a behance account or something, right.
Just something to show. No. That's great. yeah. Yeah. And then you're always practicing too. I mean, yeah, because a lot of us are doing non-paid gigs just to get, you know,
Christina Giacona: Oh,
yeah. Yeah.
Rabiah Coon (Host): some exposure. Cool.
Rabiah Coon (Host): All right. So I have a set of questions that I like to ask everybody called the "Fun Five". So the first one is what is the oldest t-shirt you have and still wear?
Christina Giacona: Oh the oldest t-shirt I have, is it OKC thunder it's a basketball team here, free [00:49:13] shirt when they got into the playoffs. I think it was their second season. It is super holey. It is soft. I love sleeping in it. That's my oldest. T-shirt I have some vintage dresses from my mom that I pull out on occasion.
Yeah. So they're, they're long flowy dresses. I occasionally fit into them occasionally don't, you know?
Rabiah Coon (Host): it depends on what part of the
Christina Giacona: pandemic you're in. Yeah, exactly.
Rabiah Coon (Host): you're in the part where we're almost out. So we're like, okay, we got to get back in shape again, or the part where
Christina Giacona: Yeah.
Rabiah Coon (Host): nice, this actually I'm excited for this one just because because of your music, but if every day was really Groundhog's Day, like people have been saying and like it's felt, I mean, it's feeling a little less like that now, but what song would you have your alarm set to play every morning?
Christina Giacona: oh, to reset, huh? Or just the start of the day.
Rabiah Coon (Host): just the start of the day. Cause Yeah.
he had "I Got You Babe" playing every time, was got annoying, [00:50:13] to be honest.
Christina Giacona: Yeah. I don't know the song that keeps coming was (singing) "I want to rock and roll all night and party everyday" . But that also seems like after like the 20th day I would go.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Lose it.
Christina Giacona: I would go yeah, ballistic, that goes to the say, like slit my throat and I was like, that's really dramatic. It's not that dramatic.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah, it would just be more anger just generally. Are you to get up ahead of your alarm to just avoid
Christina Giacona: Yeah. Maybe that, yeah, maybe that's what it would be.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Okay. So we're going with that
Christina Giacona: Let's go with that one
Rabiah Coon (Host): All right. And coffee or tea, or neither?
Christina Giacona: Coffee in the morning. I'm just a one cup in the morning. And then around four o'clock, tea.
Rabiah Coon (Host): What kind of tea do?
Christina Giacona: I usually just do black tea. Earl Grey from feeling it. An Irish Breakfast. I know I probably shouldn't drink that much caffeine at like three or four in the afternoon, but it happens
Rabiah Coon (Host): yeah, That's what we do. I know. Okay. Can you think of a time that you just were [00:51:13] laughing so hard, you cried or something that makes you just nonstop laugh when you think of it?
Christina Giacona: Usually when there's a hysterical, laughing fit, it's in a recording session and somebody does something and then somebody captures that thing and then they put it on loop. You would be surprised at how many people fart in sessions. It's like, and you know what it's like, they're probably just feeling it and it just happened.
And then somebody inevitably will make it like a fart song based off of the fart. And, you know, that's that.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Well, cause the mics are so good. They're just picking up everything. right? See, it's not like, yeah, that's funny because I mean, even on, I heard someone far down on a work call before, you know, because, and we've heard the toilet flush, So yeah. It's even worse when you're wearing headphones, listening to this.
Yeah, that's great.
Christina Giacona: I I, I was teaching online and then one of the things that the students had to do was add to put together a presentation, but a video presentation. Now, since the pandemic started [00:52:13] and I had the student, he was just going, go and go on and totally ripped ass, right? And he didn't acknowledge it.
He just kept going. And I watched that video like 20 times, like that clip. And I was like, no, maybe it's this chair, you know? It was not a trick. Then I saw in his eyes, right? Eyes got all big and he didn't want to rerecord it. He was like 15 minutes in,
Rabiah Coon (Host): So that's when he needs to know how to edit sound. Cause he probably could have just brought the level down for a moment and back up and that's it.
Christina Giacona: Oh
Rabiah Coon (Host): You're all, sir. You should sign up for this sound engineering course.
Christina Giacona: Yeah, exactly, I've got the class for you.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah, you.
could advertise those classes, just that, "ever have this happened during your dissertation?"
Christina Giacona: Let us fix it.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Awesome. Okay. And last one who inspires you right now?
Christina Giacona: Oh, okay. [00:53:13] So I have been infatuated with Paul Simon, like my entire life. I like, I probably should have chosen a Paul Simon song for like my song I'm gonna wake up to every day. How he reinvents himself like every five years is just so impressive to me. And so, you know, he writes, he wrote songs, just, you know, folk music, rock music. Then he started collaborating and including world music in to, you know, rock genres.
And then he's been working with classical, like new music ensemble, which was totally my jam when I started the LA new music ensemble. And then, Collaborating with that. I think he inspires me because he doesn't have any limits. If he has an idea, he just doesn't have mean, he wrote a musical that I think had like it ran for a week.
You know, I want to write a musical and if it fails in the first day, awesome. You know?
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah, That's I didn't know that, but that's actually, kind of, that's interesting to know [00:54:13] about the musical running for a week. I just did a solo show that was 30 minutes and it felt really bad by the end of it. Like, I'm doing one more performance, but it just wasn't what I wanted to do ultimately, but taking the risk and doing the process really helped me clarify a lot of things, which was good.
So that's nice to hear about Paul Simon doing that because I didn't know that, but he's yeah, he's super cool. I mean, when you just look at Simon and Garfunkel and then you look at Graceland, and then you look at that song, he did like what, two years ago now about like backstage trying to get a ticket or whatever, trying to get backstage.
That was fun.
Christina Giacona: yeah. There's like, I mean, I was like listening to the radio and there's this new group called AJR. They're totally fun if you're really into pop music, but it's, you know, like a higher sophisticated level of just recording a pop song, they sample it's technically a Paul Simon song Art Garfunkel sang on.
It's not a Simon and Garfunkel song. They sample it in the song. And I was just like, the first time I heard it, I was like, no way, you know? And I was like, all right. [00:55:13]
Rabiah Coon (Host): Oh, cool. Okay. AJR good. Alright. So if people want to find you and either find your performances coming up of "Cube of Light", I want to mention that becuase, I think it's going to be awesome. I gave it a listen a couple of times now, and it was kind of nice, honestly, just to have it. I've been listening to Lofi a little bit in the background, but this actually, it worked really well in the background too.
So just, it was, it was really great, but if people want to find you or find where you're performing, what's the best way to do that?
Christina Giacona: You probably search on explain our website is Onxy Lane cot com (onyxlane.com). Our Instagram handle is Onyx dot Lane (onyx.lane), cause somebody already had it. And Christina Giacona on social media. I have my own personal accounts, but they're all, you know, public and everything. And the best thing for me is if you're an artist, sure.,
Yeah. I'll obviously like, like, or follow that kind of thing, but like reach out. I love talking to people who are, you know, starting out or mid-career and we can all learn from eachother.
Rabiah Coon (Host): Yeah. Awesome. Well, Christina, thanks so much. It was a lot of fun talking to you.
Christina Giacona: Well, thank you for having me been a long time.[00:56:13]
Rabiah Coon (Host): it has been a long time. This was great.
Thanks again for listening this week. You can find out more about the guest in the show notes and at rabiah said dot com (rabiahsaid.com). Joe Maffia created the music just for this podcast. Find him on Spotify. That's Joe M A F F I A. And Rob Metke is responsible for our visual design. You can find him online by searching for Rob M E T K E. Thanks, Rob. Let me know who you'd like to hear from or about your own experiences to finding yourself outside of work. Follow at more than work pod (@morethanworkpod), or send a message on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, or LinkedIn. Or visit our website more than work pod dot com (morethanworkpod.com). Give us a follow on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you get your podcasts and leave a review if you like. Thanks for listening to More Than Work. While being kind to others, don't forget to be kind to yourself.
